Savage S 25 engine mod

[zepplin]

I deceided to attempt the Savage S25 engine mod featured in Jan 2005 RCCarAction magazine.

I have read the article over several times. I have deceided to dissasemble my fairly new S25 engine in order to get a better understanding of what is required.

I was able to remove the flywheel by removing the carborator and jamming the handle of a plastic tooth brush in the drive shaft fuel opening in order to stop it from turning when I untightend the flywheel nut. I also used the plastic toothbrush handle to pry on the backplate which was rather tight.

I am now trying to figure out how to remove the piston sleeve. It pushes up a bit when the piston reaches top dead center but no more. I tryed warming the engine with a hair dryer in hopes that heat would expand the metal. no luck. I am still looking for something that I can use to pull the sleeve out of the block that will not damage the sleeve.
Any ideas how I can get the sleeve out?

 

[vbgagnon]

put a zip tie or two in the exhaust port then turn the crank shaft. Only turn it enough to push the sleeve out so you can grab it. more then that you won't be able to take the zip ties or you'll cut them with the ports.

 

[joneser4u]

You can also use the tooth brush, with the piston up look in though where the back plate was mounted you should be able to see the bottom of the sleve, use the toothbrush and try to push the sleeve out from the bottom.

 

[Digital Liquid]

Good luck on getting the sleeve out. I have tried on 2 savage engines and had bad results. I couldn't believe how much pressure there is from the sleeve pushing on the crankcase.

The first one I tried was a beast coming out. I ended up putting a very small bur on the sleeve and had to polish it down. The second engine that I tried to remove the sleeve, was a total disaster. The sleeve ended up getting scratched, bent, broken, chipped, and totally destroyed. It was a mess.

I tried both methods that were suggested and ended up w/ mixed results. Using the zip ties only pushes the sleeve up about 25% of the way. I had to use some vice grips, pliers, etc. to get the remainder of the sleeve out. Even if only 10% of the sleeve is still stuck in the crankcase, it wouldn't come out for anything.

Pushing on the sleeve from the bottom, only ended up bending the bottom of the sleeve. Sorry, I can't give any advice on it, but I can wish you good luck. Let me know how it turns out for you.

Later.....

 

[UltegraSTI]

if u need 2 figure out how 2 pull the sleeve and thus the rest of the internals and this is also a fairly new motor. i dont think this might be the right thing to b doin w/that motor. try it 1 thats nearly dead or just an cheap old engine instead. make ur mistakes there.

-Ult

 

[olds97_lss]

Good point STI. I tried messing with an OS 15 cv-r after I ran about 6 gallons through it very angrily in my maxx... It's amazing what an OS will put up with. Many times that engine ran for a solid hour or so at 300. I was just mad at the fact that it was so sluggish in the maxx... so I took my anger out on it.

Then I tried "porting" it. There's more to it than meets the eye... after I messed with cleaning up/smoothing out the ports at an angle, doing the teardrop thing on the intake ports of the sleeve, grinding out the hole in the back of the crankshaft a little bit, messing with the carb venturi and grinding a little on the crankshaft intake, the engine had definitly seen better days

I couldn't get it to idle to save my life, but when I opened it up to WOT, it was the first time I ever saw that engine make the maxx do standing wheelies... unfortunatly I had to keep it at 1/4 throttle or more or it would die. Prior to messing with it, it would idle through a full tank of fuel without so much as a hiccup.

That was the only engine to date that I treated poorly while knowing I treated it poorly. It's also the only one I messed with the internals on. I think I'll leave it to those with the right knowledge and tools from now on.

 

[Rolex]

There's another trick for removing the flywheel nut. Remove the glow plug, bring the piston to bdc and fill the cylinder with oil. Tighten up the glow plug again and the engine is basically hydro locked.
Some sleeves can be a BEAR to get out, and will pretty much get destroyed if they don't want to cooperate.

 

[markallen]

Doing the S-25 mod is more than worth the effort.I have done 3 so far and they all run like a champ.They idle and run as good as they did stock..With about 5 times the power..Check out my video on here pulling wheelies with 18/49 effortlessly.....I plan on modifiying 3 more ...

 

[zepplin]

I saw that video it's a blast! that is the reason I decieded to go for the mod.

So far I tried pushing from the bottom of the sleeve with a toothbrush, a 1/4 inch hardwood dowel. I tried pulling the cylinder by wedging the dowel in the exhaust port and pulling- it doesn't budge. I used what should be sufficent force to do the job. My brother thinks there may be a burr. It makes sense because the sleeve moves about 3/32nds up and no more. That is about the hight that the exhaust port on the sleeve meets the top of the opening on the block,where it could be hittin. If the sleeve was just little higher I would be able to slide something under the lip. I have not fully tried using the piston to push the sleeve out. I'll have to put the backplate on again so I can crank the motor over. I can try the zip ties and maybe some heat again.

 

[markallen]

Send it to me I'll get it out.If I damage it I'll buy you a new one..

 

[olds97_lss]

That's weird... I've only had problems with one sleeve being that unwilling to come out. It was due to the fact that the con-rod shattered and totally f'd up the bottom of the sleeve and shattered the bottom of the piston. A pry bar and pair of vise-grips later, it came out... but it wasn't pretty! It also wasn't my engine... but it was so mangled that the owner didn't care. He just wanted to see what it looked like.

It was his second OS 21 RG that had a con-rod shatter on him in under a gallon of use. Never did figure out why they blew up on him.

 

[Rolex]

Put some rubbing alcohol in the freezer. Leave it there for an hour.
Then heat up the head with a heat gun. That will cause it to expand. Then pour the cold alcohol into the sleeve to make it contract. Work quickly.

 

[zepplin]

I got the bugger out. I put the backplate on. Put a zip tie in the exhaust port then turned the one way nut with a wrench. Pushed the sleeve out.

Now looking at the sleeve and looking at the article in RCCarAction... for one thing I am not sure how far down and how deep the schnuerle ports are supposed to be cut. Do they extend all the way to the bottom of the sleeve? I am not sure what size cutter to get. The one in the photo looks like it is about 3/32. I hope to find an old sleeve to practice on before attempting to cut the good one.

 

[wannarunem]

Send it to me I'll get it out.If I damage it I'll buy you a new one..

Mark...what would u charge to do this mod for others providing shipping is paid for both ways?

A friend of mine was going to attempt his but the screws holding the back plate are secured with RED locktite. They wouldnt budge.

 

[markallen]

I pmed you..

Mark...what would u charge to do this mod for others providing shipping is paid for both ways?

A friend of mine was going to attempt his but the screws holding the back plate are secured with RED locktite. They wouldnt budge.

 

[jon2]

Mark...what would u charge to do this mod for others providing shipping is paid for both ways?

A friend of mine was going to attempt his but the screws holding the back plate are secured with RED locktite. They wouldnt budge.

I am interested in this as well. Your Savage runs freaking AWESOME!!!! I got to try this out.

Let me know what the cost is if you are interested.

Thanks
Jon

 

[markallen]

You have pm as well

I am interested in this as well. Your Savage runs freaking AWESOME!!!! I got to try this out.

Let me know what the cost is if you are interested.

Thanks
Jon

 

[stinkfist]

Is there a link to this mod. I've heard of it but never seen what is involved.

Thanks,
MIke

 

[markallen]

http://www.rccaraction.com/articles/htpporting_1.asp

 

[wannarunem]

I pmed you..

Thanks mark....if i can get the screws out of the back plate i will send u the mill.

Of the ones u have done thus far...did they have red loctite on the screws that hold the back plate on?

Seems like they would have used...at the most Blue.