Kyosho Fazer MK2 Pulls to one side when accelerating.

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StephMir

RCTalk Racer
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Location
Austin, Tx
RC Driving Style
  1. Bashing
I have the Kyosho Fazer MK2. I have upgraded to FOAM wheels, aluminum shocks, metal center drive shaft, metal center drive cups, Brushless 5200kv & ESC, metal wheel hubs, carbon fiber bumper support and front/back shock towers. On 3s LiPo with 36t pinion.

The car is pulling severely to the left when I punch it past half throttle. I can ramp up slowly but, I still feel the car wanting to pull to the left at full throttle. With all the upgrades and work put into it all at one time, this is something that I'm trying to figure out since I didn't test between upgrades/rebuilds. I have replaced wheel bearings. I have rebuilt front and rear differentials with 30k silicone diff fluid. Checked shock oils levels and springs. I am thinking my problem is with differentials and fluid weight. Anyone have experience with differential weight oil should be using for On-Road 4WD RC?
 

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I have the Kyosho Fazer MK2. I have upgraded to FOAM wheels, aluminum shocks, metal center drive shaft, metal center drive cups, Brushless 5200kv & ESC, metal wheel hubs, carbon fiber bumper support and front/back shock towers. On 3s LiPo with 36t pinion.

The car is pulling severely to the left when I punch it past half throttle. I can ramp up slowly but, I still feel the car wanting to pull to the left at full throttle. With all the upgrades and work put into it all at one time, this is something that I'm trying to figure out since I didn't test between upgrades/rebuilds. I have replaced wheel bearings. I have rebuilt front and rear differentials with 30k silicone diff fluid. Checked shock oils levels and springs. I am thinking my problem is with differentials and fluid weight. Anyone have experience with differential weight oil should be using for On-Road 4WD RC?
Take the wheels off, remove the motor and spin each axle to see if there is any difference or binding on one of the axles. Do this without the diff in there too if you can. If there is no difference, try putting silly putty in one of the diffs temporarily to see if the diff is causing your issue. If it still pulls, add silly putty to the other diff. That will at least tell you if you have a diff problem because with both diffs froze up it would eliminate the diffs.

Do you notice any difference when the car is cold, vs after running for a bit?

You could try just running the piss out of it by doing speed runs on a few packs. If their is a bind somewhere, that might either loosen it up, or show you where the problem is. If you do that have an infrared temp gun handy and look for hot spots around the bearing locations.

Maybe it is as simple as torque twist is unloading one of your wheels. Try adding a little less preload on your shocks. Maybe a lighter weight shock oil. Does the car have a sway bar setup?
 
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I have the Kyosho Fazer MK2. I have upgraded to FOAM wheels, aluminum shocks, metal center drive shaft, metal center drive cups, Brushless 5200kv & ESC, metal wheel hubs, carbon fiber bumper support and front/back shock towers. On 3s LiPo with 36t pinion.

The car is pulling severely to the left when I punch it past half throttle. I can ramp up slowly but, I still feel the car wanting to pull to the left at full throttle. With all the upgrades and work put into it all at one time, this is something that I'm trying to figure out since I didn't test between upgrades/rebuilds. I have replaced wheel bearings. I have rebuilt front and rear differentials with 30k silicone diff fluid. Checked shock oils levels and springs. I am thinking my problem is with differentials and fluid weight. Anyone have experience with differential weight oil should be using for On-Road 4WD RC?
I dont have any experience with that particular rig but this is pretty good general info about diff oil weights.
Diff oil weight effects.JPG
 
Take the wheels off, remove the motor and spin each axle to see if there is any difference or binding on one of the axles. Do this without the diff in there too if you can. If there is no difference, try putting silly putty in one of the diffs temporarily to see if the diff is causing your issue. If it still pulls, add silly putty to the other diff. That will at least tell you if you have a diff problem because with both diffs froze up it would eliminate the diffs.

Do you notice any difference when the car is cold, vs after running for a bit?

You could try just running the piss out of it by doing speed runs on a few packs. If their is a bind somewhere, that might either loosen it up, or show you where the problem is. If you do that have an infrared temp gun handy and look for hot spots around the bearing locations.

Maybe it is as simple as torque twist is unloading one of your wheels. Try adding a little less preload on your shocks. Maybe a lighter weight shock oil. Does the car have a sway bar setup?

I have the Kyosho Fazer MK2. I have upgraded to FOAM wheels, aluminum shocks, metal center drive shaft, metal center drive cups, Brushless 5200kv & ESC, metal wheel hubs, carbon fiber bumper support and front/back shock towers. On 3s LiPo with 36t pinion.

The car is pulling severely to the left when I punch it past half throttle. I can ramp up slowly but, I still feel the car wanting to pull to the left at full throttle. With all the upgrades and work put into it all at one time, this is something that I'm trying to figure out since I didn't test between upgrades/rebuilds. I have replaced wheel bearings. I have rebuilt front and rear differentials with 30k silicone diff fluid. Checked shock oils levels and springs. I am thinking my problem is with differentials and fluid weight. Anyone have experience with differential weight oil should be using for On-Road 4WD RC?
Great info! I used to run strictly Off Road and applied alot of my knowledge about diffs to the On Road but coming to find out they are different when it comes to wheels on the ground and torque. My Kyosho doesn't have a center diff like my Losi Tenacity and the internal gears are different and less of them. Will try rebuilding the diffs and using silly putty on the rear and front diffs to see if that changes any thing. I'm also thinking about replacing and using a whole new set of diffs for front and back.
-The car pulls when cold or hot.
-I've done speed runs as well and got it up to +60mph. That's when I noticed it was pulling when I accelerated and it spun the wheels and it pulled into a curb. Here's some footage of the runs and crashes. Also, a near miss of the street drainage. o_O
-No sway bars yet. Those are backorder on all the sites I've seen.
-By preload, do you mean relax the springs move and make them softer? I will try that too.
Also, one of my wheels looks about 1.5mm pointing in, into the direction its pulling; left.
And the camber looks more negative on the front end. The rear wheels are wearing a bit more evenly.
There are no adjustable dog bones like on the FW06 Nitro. Wish they had more optional parts for the Fazer platform.
 
-By preload, do you mean relax the springs move and make them softer? I will try that too.
Also, one of my wheels looks about 1.5mm pointing in, into the direction its pulling; left.
And the camber looks more negative on the front end. The rear wheels are wearing a bit more evenly.
There are no adjustable dog bones like on the FW06 Nitro. Wish they had more optional parts for the Fazer platform.
Yeah, if you can soften the springs that may either make it better or worse. It just depends on if the chassis is flexing under load, shock oil, etc. Road cars are a lot more finicky when it comes to your setup, because they typically have less forgiving suspension.

You are going to have to go through a process of elimination first and see what area gives you the biggest difference. That is why I would start with the diffs. If locking them up fixes it, try going with a thicker oil in the one that showed the most improvement. You will probably want a bit thicker oil in the rear. But it helps to keep the rear loose enough so you aren't getting a ton of oversteer coming out of the corners.

Work from the extremes. Take the shock springs all the way loose, run it, tighten a little, see if it is better. Find the sweet spot. Same with the oils.

But it sounds like your toe is off. Get your steering centered and set the toe at 0. Then adjust a degree positive and run it then a degree negative and run it. See which you prefer. Keep going. Take notes.

Negative camber will allow you more traction in the corners. More negative camber=more corner traction.

Caster helps here too, but most cars don't allow this to be adjusted without swapping parts with caster blocks at a different degree. More positive caster will keep the car more stable in the straights, and get the tires leaning more in the corners (more corner traction).
 
Wouldnt use silly putty. Id use 500k or 1mil weight oil. Just my .02
 
Wouldnt use silly putty. Id use 500k or 1mil weight oil. Just my .02
Old trick a guy showed me years ago to lock up diffs. He used it to fix severe understeer on a carpeted track at our local hobby shop. The carpet was worn pretty bad, so basically he drifted the car around the corners.
 
Old trick a guy showed me years ago to lock up diffs. He used it to fix severe understeer on a carpeted track at our local hobby shop. The carpet was worn pretty bad, so basically he drifted the car around the corners.
I know people use it and it works but seems like 500k or 1 mil weight oil would accomplish the same thing with less mess?
 
I know people use it and it works but seems like 500k or 1 mil weight oil would accomplish the same thing with less mess?
No mess at all. The silly putty comes right back out. It doesn't stick to anything.
 
Thanks for the info guys. But I found the problem. The differential gears were worn down and not grabbing. At first glance you can't see the problem until you look closely at the gears and see the profile has completely worn down. I guess my homemade gasket was too thick and didn't seal correctly. Needless to say I had to order new diffs, gaskets and the diff housing for good measure.
 

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Thanks for the info guys. But I found the problem. The differential gears were worn down and not grabbing. At first glance you can't see the problem until you look closely at the gears and see the profile has completely worn down. I guess my homemade gasket was too thick and didn't seal correctly. Needless to say I had to order new diffs, gaskets and the diff housing for good measure.
Well good. I'm glad you figure out the issue :)
 
I guess my homemade gasket was too thick and didn't seal correctly. Needless to say I had to order new diffs, gaskets and the diff housing for good measure.
Yeah, if your gasket was too thick it would have given you a gear mesh that was too open, causing the gears to wear quickly. Best to stick with the proper parts there 😉
 
Received my Titanium Center Drive Shaft from KanizRC. Very nice quality and workmanship. I also received my new front and rear differentials, bearings, seals, gears & gaskets. Had to replace both diffs gears since I stripped them out. Basically, a complete teardown except the electronics. Putting 30k diff oil in both diffs to see how it acts. I got 10k and 7k oils on standby, but we'll see. Also need new foamies. My old ones are wearing.
 

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Awesome, I almost bought one a while back. I'm used to there gt stuff.. I had a kyosho gt2 electric 6s and a nitro at one point.. kyosho has some great quality.. in fact that once they are off backorder I am going to order another gt2 1/8th
 
I haven't pulled the trigger on a 1/8 scale. I'm sticking with 1/10 for now. If I do go larger I'll probably go electric. I LOVE nitro but its very "temperamental" here in Texas.
I had a small run tonight in my cul de sac with the Fazer. I got the new diffs installed and new foamies (Contact RC Racing Tyres 30mm 1/10 Nitro Sedan Foam Rear Tires I use in Front and Rear. 35 & 42 Shore 12mm Hex. I only have the 4 x 35 shore installed and it seems very quiet, fast and handles very SMOOTH. I rebuilt the rear differential and put 3k in the REAR & 30k in the FRONT and this configuration feels so TIGHT & RIGHT!
I'm going to try and make a video this week of the speed and stability. I got it a bit dusty just running on the street. But with an air compressor and a detail brush I looks very clean. TIP: Clean your RC.
I did manage to put the front tire hub clips facing the rear so they won't pop off. I basically, swapped the right and left hubs. See picture. It helps if you don't hit too many curbs but, that's unavoidable at times in STREET BASHING.
 

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After all these upgrades and rebuilding both differentials, buying new tires, adding the metal Swing Front Shafts the car still pulling to the left when I punch the accelerator. It looks like the front right wheel is pointing too far inward causing the car to pull to the left. Is there a way to straighten it or adjust it? I am going to adjust the springs and tighten them up a bit in the front right side and/or soften them a bit to see how it acts. Just a little frustrating there aren't too many adjustments on this platform.
 

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That kit is meant to be more of an entry level car, but it's not to hard to modify steering linkages. If you build some custom links to replace your steering links, you can make them adjustable.
20211025_223808.jpg


What you need to do is find some turnbuckles like the ones below, but you will have to figure out what size you need. I have no idea how long yours are, but measure your links from the center of the ball on one end, and center of the hole on the other. Get some link ends and lay them out with the same distance, and measure and see how long your turnbuckle will need to be.

Link ends here. Order these first, or something similar. They come in various thread sizes. 3mm, 4mm, etc...
https://www.ebay.com/itm/M3-Size-Sh...2349624.m46890.l49286&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0

Here are some turnbuckles for reference, but you need to figure out how long you need first, and what size thread you want. This is just to show you what you are looking for. Note: these have a left-hand thread and a right-hand usually, but some have right-hand threads on both ends.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Lunsford-R...2349624.m46890.l49286&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0

Once you build some adjustable links, you can adjust your toe using the turnbuckle.

Another way to do it is build a custom link and replace the tie rod here so it is adjustable, using similar parts.
20211025_225507.jpg
 
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Ordered the FW06 turnbuckles from KyoshoAmerica.com. Same Pillow Ball Set. Need to test on Speed runs.
Also, speed run from before ran rough when 36t Pinion came loose inside Motor Mount case; even with RED Locktite. Ground metal 36t Pinion and Spur Gear. Not too bad but still need to look into possibly replacing Hex Set Screw for pinion. Driving in high speeds was a bit more stable with the Front Metal Universal Swing Shaft S and not pulling AS MUCH but these turnbuckles should make the car even more stable.
Thanks to all for all the help/input!
 

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