Thunder Tiger Evo-12 swapped into a Kyosho FW-06

[gandalfnz]

Just went trough my box of clutch bells and found a 18/23 which you said you used for your speed runs.
How fast can it go on a stock clutch bell?

 

[tudordewolf]

Just went trough my box of clutch bells and found a 18/23 which you said you used for your speed runs.
How fast can it go on a stock clutch bell?

I clocked 39mph with a VX-18, which tracks with the math. An 18/23 should be 9.5% faster in second gear.

I use this calculator and got 29k rpm for the engine rpm, which is even a little better than the 28k it's rated to. The diffs have a reduction of ~2.92, so add that to your pinion/spur ratios. Stock pinions are 44/39, for a stock 2nd gear of ~5.4, modded ~4.9

The Evo-12P version hit 43mph with stock gearing, which means it was peaking at about 33k rpm. I haven't paired that with an 18/23 yet... soon.

 

[gandalfnz]

Heres a video of the Flying Fish after break in.
You be the judge.

 

[tudordewolf]

Looks like it's running real nice!

 

[gandalfnz]

Looks like it's running real nice!

Thanks!
Its a bit sluggish compared to RS4, I wonder if that will fade away when its broken in more, say after one gallon.
Have adjust the the second speed and it was shifting too early from that video.

 

[gandalfnz]

Hey dude

Have you ever considered buying an SH engine instead of VX?
Been reading about it, and apparently its more grunty, also the fact that it comes with a slide carb instead of rotary makes me believe it would be more responsive.
Considering buying one of them from Ali.
Let me know what you think?

Cheers

 

[tudordewolf]

Have you ever considered buying an SH engine instead of VX?
Been reading about it, and apparently its more grunty, also the fact that it comes with a slide carb instead of rotary makes me believe it would be more responsive.
Considering buying one of them from Ali.
Let me know what you think?

Funny you ask, I've got one on the shelf waiting to be swapped in. Amain is selling piston/sleeve pairs for $20 so it's a tempting basher engine.

It looks & feels a bit nicer. The connecting rod is knife-edged and polished as opposed to the squarish one from a VX-18, for example.

I put SH's rotary carb on my VX-18 engine very successfully, I don't doubt their overall quality is better.

I think I'd try it in a truck since it's purported to be torquier; I don't know that I'd experience any increase in performance over the VX-18 in something light like an onroad, where a high-revving .12 has more to offer in terms of performance gains.

 

[gandalfnz]

Funny you ask, I've got one on the shelf waiting to be swapped in. Amain is selling piston/sleeve pairs for $20 so it's a tempting basher engine.

It looks & feels a bit nicer. The connecting rod is knife-edged and polished as opposed to the squarish one from a VX-18, for example.

I put SH's rotary carb on my VX-18 engine very successfully, I don't doubt their overall quality is better.

I think I'd try it in a truck since it's purported to be torquier; I don't know that I'd experience any increase in performance over the VX-18 in something light like an onroad, where a high-revving .12 has more to offer in terms of performance gains.

If anyone would have info on it, I had a feeling you would.
So how does VX feel with a slide carb, is it more snappy on the throttle?
Did you get an SH18? I believe they are with the size exhaust, all sizes up have a back exhaust?
This the one?
https://www.amainhobbies.com/sh-engines-.18-piston-sleeve-shete1824d/p524237
Not bad I guess. You would need a conrod for it too, at least I would do after each Piston/Sleeve replacement. Bearings I just leave as is, unless they got too much play.

 

[tudordewolf]

You would need a conrod for it too

Only another $8 - https://www.amainhobbies.com/sh-engines-.18-connecting-rod-shete1808a1/p524231

I even got the wrist pin and clips, another couple bucks. I've put together a whole rebuild "kit" for 4 different engines just to have peace of mind when running them.

Apparently it's the same conrod as the Dynamite .19T; I've had them side by side and couldn't tell the difference.

I havn't put a slide carb on a VX-18 yet, just the fancier rotary carb from SH because I though I was having tuning issues with the default one, though that might have just been my inexperience at the time.

Yup, side-exhaust - I haven't seen anything bigger than a .18 with a side exhaust, but on the flipside rear exhaust small block engines tend to be .12's rather than .15 or .18's

 

[gandalfnz]

Only another $8 - https://www.amainhobbies.com/sh-engines-.18-connecting-rod-shete1808a1/p524231

I even got the wrist pin and clips, another couple bucks. I've put together a whole rebuild "kit" for 4 different engines just to have peace of mind when running them.

Apparently it's the same conrod as the Dynamite .19T; I've had them side by side and couldn't tell the difference.

I havn't put a slide carb on a VX-18 yet, just the fancier rotary carb from SH because I though I was having tuning issues with the default one, though that might have just been my inexperience at the time.

I haven't seen anything bigger than a .18 with a side exhaust, but on the flipside rear exhaust small block engines tend to be .12's rather than .15 or .18's

Aweome, I might grab an SH and a few piston/sleeve as well, spending way too much on this hobby.

Did you say that your VX sounded different with this header, is this car of yours running, any chance of a video?

 

[tudordewolf]

Aweome, I might grab an SH and a few piston/sleeve as well, spending way too much on this hobby.

Did you say that your VX sounded different with this header, is this car of yours running, any chance of a video?

View attachment 151773

Here's one the captures the sound pretty well, I thought it was a bit "smoother" a note.

It's worth noting that there's at least two versions of that manifold, I've bought both. I like the skinner one more.

 

[gandalfnz]

The engine in the vid is using vx 18 stock carb? Returns to idle so well and really fast, sounds like a slide carb?

Could you pls link the good exhaust, so I get the right one. They all seem the same to me from the photos on Ali.

Cheers

 

[tudordewolf]

This listing has both types, you want "type 3"

I think in that video I'd upgraded to the SH rotary carb - https://www.amazon.com/Redcat-Racing-TE1809D1-SH18-Carburetor/dp/B00E5L8L10

That's a little overpriced from amazon, I got a couple for about $35.

I think the fuel cap plays a bit of a factor, I found the stock one can restrict flow a little, reducing the fuel pressure and making the engine run lean / cut out unexpectedly, especially if it gets gummed up with oil.

I also upgraded to JX 4409MG servos (~$15 each), they're strong and speedy without drawing too much current.

 

[gandalfnz]

This listing has both types, you want "type 3"

I think in that video I'd upgraded to the SH rotary carb - https://www.amazon.com/Redcat-Racing-TE1809D1-SH18-Carburetor/dp/B00E5L8L10

That's a little overpriced from amazon, I got a couple for about $35.

I think the fuel cap plays a bit of a factor, I found the stock one can restrict flow a little, reducing the fuel pressure and making the engine run lean / cut out unexpectedly, especially if it gets gummed up with oil.

I also upgraded to JX 4409MG servos (~$15 each), they're strong and speedy without drawing too much current.

You are sinking some serious $ into that rig.
I think I will just get the manifolds, as one of my RS4's is running the old style 15FE manifold, looks the same as stock VX.

I don't understand what you mean about the fuel cap, its sole purpose is just to seal the tank so that vacuum is possible.
It either seals properly or it doesn't.
Funny that, I noticed on my Ffish build, there are air bubbles in the fuel line when the car just stops....

 

[tudordewolf]

I don't understand what you mean about the fuel cap, its sole purpose is just to seal the tank so that vacuum is possible.

It's also the port for the exhaust gasses into the fuel tank via the tube from the pipe. If that passage is clogged, you'll get effects akin to "half-tank lean," when you rev the engine it won't get a corresponding increase in fuel flow.

The carburetor does draw fuel in via the venturi effect, but a good tune counts on pressure from the exhaust acting on the fuel in the tank.

The stock fuel cap basically has 2 slots cut into the post that a screw goes into; this creates kind of a "pinch point" in the cap where oil can interrupt the smooth delivery of exhaust pressure.

Edit: illustrated below. See how the slots for the exhaust aren't all that wide, and mostly closed off by the screw, too. You can widen them a little with an exacto or narrow file, but the aluminum caps fix this problem entirely with 2 screws and a complete open pathway for the gasses.

 

[gandalfnz]

Amazing, never given this much thought mate, just made sure the lines were clean and not blocked (which is hard to happen tbh) when doing my builds.
I will try and have a look to see what the ALU fuel cap looks like from the bottom.
So tell me something, which upgrades according to you made a decent performance increase over the stock gear?

 

[tudordewolf]

I noticed on my Ffish build, there are air bubbles in the fuel line when the car just stops....

I think it's from the fuel filter, I tried using one too, but it would collect bubbles and give uneven tuning.

I had it manifest in shutdowns / lean runs when they'd get sucked through all at once.

which upgrades according to you made a decent performance increase over the stock gear?

Bearings throughout the hubs, servos with less slop, aluminum steering rack, hexes, exhaust manifold, clutch bell, fuel tank cap, carburetor, upgraded radio gear to get finer endpoint control: Radiolink in my case, with the RC6G receiver. Also has tunable gyro settings which this car responds to well

I've been running mine on Torco 30% fuel with an OS #8 and it's been running great, and staying cool even with multiple long pulls to top speed.

CVD's on the front are arguably a good upgrade, though they need some extra finishing to work optimally. The stock dogbones scrape against the cups at max steering throw.

Upgrades that are more vanity: Exhaust that points 90 degrees away from the car. I find the angled exhausts spray too much on the body / rear quarter. and then it collects dust and grit.

CVD's on the rear look cool and turn smoothly, maybe better for max speed runs. More maintenance / build effort though.

I'm starting to appreciate why my FW-06 came with CVD's only on the front.

Now that I think about it, all the important upgrades are the ones that bridge the gap between the stock Fish and an FW-06.

Aluminum diff cases allow you to tune your mesh on the differentials better via shims, I find the ring gears sometimes come out-of-center/round with the diff case, the screws are probably tightened down 1-2-3-4 instead of in a star pattern and needs a bit of loosening/re-tightening to mesh smoothly all the way around.

Upgrades I have removed: Servo saver, fuel filter, breather air filter - I like the 2-piece stock one more. There's kinda crappy versions out there, but the "real" one with a fairly thick boot and 2 fine sponges does an amazing job, it's even caught muddy water and kept it from hitting the engine.

 

[gandalfnz]

I think it's from the fuel filter, I tried using one too, but it would collect bubbles and give uneven tuning.

I had it manifest in shutdowns / lean runs when they'd get sucked through all at once.



Bearings throughout the hubs, servos with less slop, aluminum steering rack, hexes, exhaust manifold, clutch bell, fuel tank cap, carburetor, upgraded radio gear to get finer endpoint control: Radiolink in my case, with the RC6G receiver. Also has tunable gyro settings which this car responds to well

I've been running mine on Torco 30% fuel with an OS #8 and it's been running great, and staying cool even with multiple long pulls to top speed.

CVD's on the front are arguably a good upgrade, though they need some extra finishing to work optimally. The stock dogbones scrape against the cups at max steering throw.

Upgrades that are more vanity: Exhaust that points 90 degrees away from the car. I find the angled exhausts spray too much on the body / rear quarter. and then it collects dust and grit.

CVD's on the rear look cool and turn smoothly, maybe better for max speed runs. More maintenance / build effort though.

I'm starting to appreciate why my FW-06 came with CVD's only on the front.

Now that I think about it, all the important upgrades are the ones that bridge the gap between the stock Fish and an FW-06.

Aluminum diff cases allow you to tune your mesh on the differentials better via shims, I find the ring gears sometimes come out-of-center/round with the diff case, the screws are probably tightened down 1-2-3-4 instead of in a star pattern and needs a bit of loosening/re-tightening to mesh smoothly all the way around.

Upgrades I have removed: Servo saver, fuel filter, breather air filter - I like the 2-piece stock one more. There's kinda crappy versions out there, but the "real" one with a fairly thick boot and 2 fine sponges does an amazing job, it's even caught muddy water and kept it from hitting the engine.

Sounds like you did a lot!

What happened with your spurs, when they ended up damaged like that, bad mesh or stones?

I have purchased the manifolds you recommended today, but am going to leave it as is now, after all it will be my main basher, and I will replace parts as needed.

The only itch I have now is that SH motor, would love to try it out.
Cmon, break in yours and send me a video?

BTW, I need to correct myself, I had an issue with manifold gap and leak on an actual HPI ( not on a mini cooper as I said before).
I had to make a reducer for an original HPI manifold, but I believe this manifold was originally designed for 15 FE engine, not a G3.0 on which I installed it, so maybe its because of that. This one also is getting replaced as well as the HSP fish when the arrive. I purchased two.

Cheers dude!

 

[tudordewolf]

What happened with your spurs, when they ended up damaged like that, bad mesh or stones?

I flipped it (again...) during my most recent bash and knocked the engine mounts loose - which I didn't notice at first so I ran it until it stopped moving, eating the gears away pretty quickly. I haven't had foreign object damage on this one yet, I think the large bottom chassis protects it pretty well.

 

[gandalfnz]

Ordered two fuel alu fuel caps as well.

Do you have an off road buggy or something?
I see you like to use the fish as an off roader.

On the SH engine, the clutch system from VX is a straight fit? No need for any modification?
Is the shaft the same lenght and also square where it meets the engine, like the VX?

Cheers