Restoration Project #8 - Huge Bundle of HPI, Kyosho and HSP.

[tudordewolf]

You didn't have to heat up the crankcase to insert the bearing in?

Man I have been having this one issue with my FFish that followed me trough all my builds and I never managed to figure out what it is. Even with the old VX engine.

When the fuel tank gets about about 1/4 I start getting massive air pockets in the fuel line, in fact sometimes they are so big, that the car will just starve of fuel and shut off on me.
Fuel system is absolutely air tight, and this only happens after a WOT. If I hold the car in my hand, its fine, let it go and come back, there's air pockets.
I have just moved the fuel tank below the top plastic bracket that holds it, thinking its that, as I had it mounted on top. No difference.
Maybe the exhaust pipe is not providing enough pressure to the fuel tank once it gets near empty?
I don't know, but car sounds like the tune is off when this happens.

I warmed it with a heat gun, placed the bearing on the crankshaft and used that to line it up and insert it, and it popped in as easily as a wheel bearing. I was a little surprised, it didn't take any force at all to seat it, the SH.12 I'd done a few days ago had more of a "pop," and I preheated that too.

I've had similar issues with the fuel line drawing air, I think that's part of the reason I like to keep the tank over 50% full. I can only guess that the sloshing & vibrations from driving are foaming up the fuel enough that it's sucking up air bubbles before running out.

I'll add about the under-mounting, I "sandwich" my fuel tank between o-rings for extra vibration dampening. This also lowers it such that the bottom of the fuel tank and overflow tube both sit "in" their cutouts in the chassis, which I find satisfying. On the other hand, it may be transferring vibrations into the tank through the bottom as a consequence, but I haven't had any air bubble issues in a while. I also ditched the inline fuel filters, because when I was having air-bubble issues, it seemed like those would "gather' little air bubbles and then release them all at once as a big air pocket and stall the engine. I had them mounted horizontally, maybe they wouldn't do this if they were vertical.

Like I said though, I tend to top every few minutes, so I may have just squashed it the blunt-force way, and it's possible nothing about my physical setup changed any of that.

 

[gandalfnz]

I am sure its something to do with the fuel supply, I was thinking of either replacing a fuel tank, maybe raising it, and changing the exhaust.
I am determined to get to the bottom of this, just haven't had the time.

Other than that, car is a rocket, beats any of my Kyoshos or HPI's in terms of acceleration and speed.
The SH18 engine, is probably the best I have ever owned, compression on that thing is incredible, even after half a gallon trough it.
Engine is so tight, its hard to pull on the pull starter. I was always surprised how Kyosho engines lacked the pinch of cheaper engines.
Oh, 2 speed can be glitchy at times, so will need to replaced that with a metal version, and prob shim it so that engagement pin does not wear out as quick.

 

[tudordewolf]

Is that the rear-exhaust SH.18 you're talking about? "GS18"? I'm thinking of putting mine in the HSP Short-Course truck. Like I've mentioned before, My goal is to have one of each HSP variant each with a different souped-up engine.

Got the truck put back together, it runs great with the ceramic bearing - even idles lower than before. I added a wheelie bar, but it still has enough power to pop itself completely over if I'm not careful. I might go up a tooth or two on the clutch bell to try and get that under control, and squeeze a little more top-end speed out of it, though I do like how it performs with the absurd torque- I barely have to touch the throttle to keep it flying and the engine is never struggling.

I got it down to about 1/4 tank and I started having tuning issues like you're dealing with- might just be a caveat of the design, or good old "half-tank-lean."

 

[gandalfnz]

Sorry, my bad I was talking about SH15. Incredible engine!

Thats a cool wheelie bar, is that HSP made?

 

[tudordewolf]

Sorry, my bad I was talking about SH15. Incredible engine!

Thats a cool wheelie bar, is that HSP made?

It is! Found it on Ali as "HSP Wheelie bar", Jz9193 carries it. Clips right onto the rear bumper.

 

[gandalfnz]

Sorry, I told you wrong again, its a Force 18 engine.... on my hsp on road.
Try and pair that GS18 with at GXR18 carb and see what you think.

 

[tudordewolf]

Sorry, I told you wrong again, its a Force 18 engine.... on my hsp on road.
Try and pair that GS18 with at GXR18 carb and see what you think.

Solid idea! First I want to see if I can hit 60 with my SH-12 build, it's taken a bit more work than I expected.

Side note about the versatility of the HSP vehicles, it still surprises me that these are built on basically the same platform, just a different chassis plate and suspension arms:

 

[gandalfnz]

@tudordewolf

Hey Mate, 2 speed gearbox in my Fish has finally given up the ghost. I think that Force 15 engine really made it work hard. That engine is still so tight with over a gallon of fuel trough it, I think its still breaking in.
I have just ordered the fully metal version, hopefully it will last longer, any experience with them?

Been watching your wheelie monster vids, runs awesome.
I had a rustler with a 3.3 that would wheelie all the time, in the end I realized it was overpowered and just needed the car to stay on all 4 and get some speed. Sold it.
Maybe gear it up and get some nice speed out of it.

Also, I purchased a barely used C link fish for $20, will post pics once its here. I have zero room left for rc cars, but a good deal is a good deal!

 

[tudordewolf]

@tudordewolf

Hey Mate, 2 speed gearbox in my Fish has finally given up the ghost. I think that Force 15 engine really made it work hard. That engine is still so tight with over a gallon of fuel trough it, I think its still breaking in.
I have just ordered the fully metal version, hopefully it will last longer, any experience with them?

Been watching your wheelie monster vids, runs awesome.
I had a rustler with a 3.3 that would wheelie all the time, in the end I realized it was overpowered and just needed the car to stay on all 4 and get some speed. Sold it.
Maybe gear it up and get some nice speed out of it.

Also, I purchased a barely used C link fish for $20, will post pics once its here. I have zero room left for rc cars, but a good deal is a good deal!

I bought the metal gears for mine and never installed them because of the weight, I just keep a couple spares of the plastic gears on hand, they've been pretty reliable for me once I ironed out all the quirks, but they do occasionally strip under rough conditions.

Part of the reason is that it took me a reasonably long time to collect compatible 2-speed clutch bells other than the stock 16/21. Now I've got them going from 13/18 to 18/23, and a few in between too. I wouldn't want to run those with metal gears though, as I'd prefer to sacrifice the replaceable $1 part rather than unique, hard-to-replace one.

One their biggest flaws is that little metal pin that the clutch grabs can get pulled out of the gear by the "claw" over time. My solution was to hammer the end of the pin to slightly mushroom it at once end, then re-insert it with the wide end "behind" the gear (on the opposite side of the clutch), and I haven't had one fail that way since.

Exacerbating the issue is the fact that bare replacement gears come _without_ the insert pin! This kind of blows my mind, because it's not its own part anywhere in the documentation, and the gear will work without the pin but fail after just a few shifts as the metal claw easily cuts through the plastic. Given the effort of modifying the pin, I've pulled my modded pin out of a shredded gear and used it in the replacement more than once.

Nice find with the FFish, it's nearly impossible to pass up a nitro under $50...

 

[gandalfnz]

I bought the metal gears for mine and never installed them because of the weight, I just keep a couple spares of the plastic gears on hand, they've been pretty reliable for me once I ironed out all the quirks, but they do occasionally strip under rough conditions.

Part of the reason is that it took me a reasonably long time to collect compatible 2-speed clutch bells other than the stock 16/21. Now I've got them going from 13/18 to 18/23, and a few in between too. I wouldn't want to run those with metal gears though, as I'd prefer to sacrifice the replaceable $1 part rather than unique, hard-to-replace one.

One their biggest flaws is that little metal pin that the clutch grabs can get pulled out of the gear by the "claw" over time. My solution was to hammer the end of the pin to slightly mushroom it at once end, then re-insert it with the wide end "behind" the gear (on the opposite side of the clutch), and I haven't had one fail that way since.

Exacerbating the issue is the fact that bare replacement gears come _without_ the insert pin! This kind of blows my mind, because it's not its own part anywhere in the documentation, and the gear will work without the pin but fail after just a few shifts as the metal claw easily cuts through the plastic. Given the effort of modifying the pin, I've pulled my modded pin out of a shredded gear and used it in the replacement more than once.

Nice find with the FFish, it's nearly impossible to pass up a nitro under $50...

Hello

I will see once its here what to do with a metal gearbox. The current gearing on this Fish is really good, car is a rocket and so much faster than any of my Kyoshos or HPI's. I cannot recommend this Force 15 engine high enough, never seen a pinch like that on a .15 engine.
I will guy a few more of these engines eventually, as they are a direct drop in for Kyosho or HPi.

It looks like the little claw shat itself from hitting on the spur engagement pin. The pin on mine looks fine, no movement, which is good, but that little play is what destroys it. Did you figure out a way how to solve this, I think I shimmed this a while back but now cannot remember. Luckily I have a bag full of brand new claw assembly, but it will suffer the same fate unless I modify it somehow. Just checked more closely, there is too much play between 1st and 2nd spur, like 2-3 mm of play.

Currently I have this one and Kyosho FW-06 both with busted transmissions, Kyosho OWB is slipping, which is unusual. The thing is, they want $30 just for the OWB, because its pressed into another metal assembly, so its not just OWB on its own. I found a way to press it out, and have some $5 OWB's on their way, so I will just re-press it in again, and that's that problem fixed.

 

[tudordewolf]

I never had as much issue with play with my gears as you report to have in yours, but I can't think of any reason why that would happen. We get them from the same place... Mine tend to strip because the engine shifted in its mounts after a hard tumble and I'm dumb enough to send it again instead of checking it, or because they just ingest too many pebbles doing burnouts in gravel.

I had a rustler with a 3.3 that would wheelie all the time, in the end I realized it was overpowered and just needed the car to stay on all 4 and get some speed. Sold it.
Maybe gear it up and get some nice speed out of it.

One of my primary goals for that build was to have a truck that wheelies, I haven't had any full-sized RC's with that kind of instant power before. It wouldn't wheelie at all with the stock 16T clutch bell, and it would flip onto its back even with a wheelie bar on 13T. 14T seems to be the sweet spot where it wheelies but also rips, I clock it at 25mph across any terrain, it kind of "floats" on thick grass once it's going fast enough.

I splurged and got the RCRenew modded crank for it, but haven't dropped it in yet. Looks nice.

 

[gandalfnz]

I never had as much issue with play with my gears as you report to have in yours, but I can't think of any reason why that would happen. We get them from the same place... Mine tend to strip because the engine shifted in its mounts after a hard tumble and I'm dumb enough to send it again instead of checking it, or because they just ingest too many pebbles doing burnouts in gravel.




One of my primary goals for that build was to have a truck that wheelies, I haven't had any full-sized RC's with that kind of instant power before. It wouldn't wheelie at all with the stock 16T clutch bell, and it would flip onto its back even with a wheelie bar on 13T. 14T seems to be the sweet spot where it wheelies but also rips, I clock it at 25mph across any terrain, it kind of "floats" on thick grass once it's going fast enough.

I splurged and got the RCRenew modded crank for it, but haven't dropped it in yet. Looks nice.

View attachment 174951

I will get to the bottom as to why the 1st gear spur has too much play, could be the bearing, and most likely will need some shims in there as well.
Will get it repaired and give it another go before new heavy weight parts comes in.

I always found TRX 3.3 to be a real powerful engine, with a very good top end. Its already a screamer.
Good on you for trying something new such as the modded crankshaft. Hopefully it wont blow up or melt, since they run a bit hot as is.

Only one way to find out, can we expect the results and a video sometime during 2025?

 

[gandalfnz]

Do you think a slide carb can be installed on a C link Fish?
I see the servo is rotated 90 degrees compared to pivot suspension model.
Gonna give it a try, throttle response is much better with a slide carb. It will be interesting to see how VX18 behaves with one.

 

[tudordewolf]

Do you think a slide carb can be installed on a C link Fish?
I see the servo is rotated 90 degrees compared to pivot suspension model.
Gonna give it a try, throttle response is much better with a slide carb. It will be interesting to see how VX18 behaves with one.

If you replace the radio tray with the pivot ball version, definitely, so the servo sits next to the engine instead of slightly behind it, like you did on your force car.

Here's how I did mine on one of my pivot builds- I mounted the carb linkage under the servo arm so the brake rod could pass over it.

I did that to my c-link fish anyway because I like the rectangular tray more than the "staircase" shape...

 

[gandalfnz]

If you replace the radio tray with the pivot ball version, definitely, so the servo sits next to the engine instead of slightly behind it, like you did on your force car.

Here's how I did mine on one of my pivot builds- I mounted the carb linkage under the servo arm so the brake rod could pass over it.

View attachment 175009

I did that to my c-link fish anyway because I like the rectangular tray more than the "staircase" shape...

Maybe I will end up converting the C link to Pivot ball version, unsure yet, will see how the car behaves on the road. As long as it goes straight, I be happy with it.

Its now ready for a street race, with my older boy, lets hope they stay in one piece after it. Came with body as well, its literally like new.
Had to remove the wheels it came with as they were not glued on properly.

This is the new C link version I just purchased.

 

[gandalfnz]

@tudordewolf

Hey dude, I need your help!

Do you know what are the part numbers for no 12 and 13 parts on this drawing?
I am having difficulties finding them.
I keep breaking dog bones on my FIsh, because no 13 shaft is bent, its always been like that.
I am done with wasting wasting dog bones and decided to order a a replacement.

Cheers

 

[tudordewolf]

@tudordewolf

Hey dude, I need your help!

Do you know what are the part numbers for no 12 and 13 parts on this drawing?
I am having difficulties finding them.
I keep breaking dog bones on my FIsh, because no 13 shaft is bent, its always been like that.
I am done with wasting wasting dog bones and decided to order a a replacement.

Cheers

Those together are HSP #02030

 

[gandalfnz]

Those together are HSP #02030

Thanks dude.

I managed to source one locally at 5 x price.

 

[gandalfnz]

@tudordewolf

Hey bud, no one to help me with this but you!

Purchased 3 piece clutch kit from our guy at Ali, only to realize its not a direct fit on VX18, which I thought it would be.
Noticed that crankshaft on this engine is slotted, and the shaft nut is also too big.

What do I need to do to get this to work?

Those half moon original clutch pads are breaking so often, I am done with them. Kids too hard on blipping the throttle.

Thanks

 

[tudordewolf]

You'll want a Kyosho pilot shaft NT024. This will allow you to use 2 shoes of the 3 piece clutch with the stock flywheel, much like a stock FW-06.

2 is plenty since those are 1/8th clutches.

I too grew sick of the half-moon clutches and upgraded the whole fleet to "shoe" style clutches. I find they also make it easier to tune engines that like to idle a little high, since I'm not fighting drag from the clutch.

BTW, I've started my plane journey, joined the local club and started building my first nitro plane.