Getting your thoughts on what to do or buy

[jfischer]

I have been doing a LOT of reading on here, and have to admit that I am totally new to crawling.

I have raced cars, trucks and such for many years, and do pretty good at them, but it is getting cooler and the local hobby shop has setup a inside course with many rocks (6"-12") sharp edges, and climbs that are pretty steep with obstacles on them to navigate going up and down.

What would be something good to start out with, I see many different kinds of chassis, and would like to build something up that is strong, and can navigate the large rocks.

I read a lot on shocks and droop, and know what droop does on racing cars and trucks, and can see the advantage of keeping things low for the CG, but wouldn't that hurt more on sharp rocks that that chassis would get hung up on?

Charlie and the others, waiting to hear back from you, and if nothing else drop me a note on where to start, or you might have something that would interest me.
Jeff

 

[h8z2luze]

Well i am JUST beginning as in getting ready to order my crawler but from what I hear the Axial ARTR is the way to go. That's what I am ordering. Good luck man!

 

[alpinehyperlite]

Yes, a great way to get started is to get the axial ARTR kit. It comes with everything pre-assembled, with the exception of: Motor, Steering Servo, radio, and reciever. Everything else is ready to go. And it has more upgrades on it than the kit. The way the crawler motors work are not for speed, but for maximum torque and throttle control. With these ESC's and high turn motors, we can go from forward, to reverse, back to forward with no delay. The droop setup is somthing that i have not even looked into. it lowers your cog but you lose control.

You can look at setups that "webbage" "Charlestheman" me, and "Chip Cross" have put together. There are others, but i can't think of them off the top of my head. Any questions, just ask.

 

[h8z2luze]

Yes, a great way to get started is to get the axial ARTR kit. It comes with everything pre-assembled, with the exception of: Motor, Steering Servo, radio, and reciever. Everything else is ready to go. And it has more upgrades on it than the kit. The way the crawler motors work are not for speed, but for maximum torque and throttle control. With these ESC's and high turn motors, we can go from forward, to reverse, back to forward with no delay. The droop setup is somthing that i have not even looked into. it lowers your cog but you lose control.

You can look at setups that "webbage" "Charlestheman" me, and "Chip Cross" have put together. There are others, but i can't think of them off the top of my head. Any questions, just ask.

Dont mean to be a ass but you forgot the battery

 

[CharliesTheMan]

Welcome to the crawler side of life. I've got to go do a few things, and then I will come back and replace this post with lots of information. People send me PM's asking why I'm ignoring them if I don't answer a post immidiately, so I just wanted to let you know that I'm going to get to it.

The Axial ARTR is definitely the most bang for the buck. In fact I just bought one a few weeks ago for one of my newest projects.

 

[alpinehyperlite]

Dont mean to be a ass but you forgot the battery

Knew i forgot somthin. Thanks ass. lol

IDK if the artr has the low cog plate on front axle, bit if it dont, it is a plus, so you can lower the COG with the battery not sitting on top of the rig. Or if you wana run lipo, i just made my own little plate out of lexan sitting between the front shocks.

 

[robmob]

The ARTR is definitely the way to go.

I just ordered my 2nd one for my next project now that the Warthog is complete.

 

[jfischer]

Still waiting to hear back from a few on here as to what they like, and what they would suggest.

Seems the ARTR is out of stock at most places.

I have seen what sounds like a few good used rigs, but holding off until I get more opinions and thoughts here.

About went for a rig on FleaBay that had a ton of things with it, but wasn't put together, but the bidding went crazy at the end, and figure if I am going to pay that much, I soiuld put a combination together that I want.

Jeff

 

[CharliesTheMan]

I wouldn't advise buying a used rig from someone that you don't know. The Axial ARTR will be showing up in stock most places in a week or so. RPP has some in stock right now for $235. That's the best vendor that I feel comfortable reccomending people to buy from besides East End Machining, because I know I can trust Corey, who runs RPP.

http://www.shop.rpphobby.com/product.sc?categoryId=94&productId=929

The ARTR has several upgrades over the kit version, which makes it well worth the money. It has Pro-Line Hammer M2 crawler tires along with memory foams already installed. That upgrade alone is VERY important, as you wouldn't want to use the tires that come with the kit even just to start out with. It also comes with heavy duty lockers in the axles (very important) and a rear straight axle conversion, which is quite durable, lightweight, and looks good. Also included are bent links for the rear, which increase the ground clearance quite a bit. Last is the Axial XC1 comp body, which is a much better body than the B17 that's included in the kit, performs well, and only requires minimal trimming. The orange chassis and orange painted body look great together as well, MUCH better than the played out green that everyone has on their stock kits IMO

For electronics, Castle Creations has some of the best ESC's on the market. The sidewinder and mamba max are bother wonderful ESC's, and it's all I run in my crawlers. They're fully programmable, have the drag brake that you need in a crawler and no reverse delay, low voltage cutoff, will run up to 4S LiPo, and will run brushed or brushless motors.

It's VERY important to start out with a good ESC when you build your rig. I think it's one of the most important parts on your crawler to spend a little money on, and you can get a sidewinder used for $40-$50, which isn't bad at all. The Mamba runs around $100 used and $130 new. The Tekin FXR is also a nice ESC, but it will ony run brushed motors, and the sidewinder is cheaper even if you buy the optional castle link programming kit for the PC. The mamba max doesn't need any additional programming kit to connect it via USB.

For a motor, I only run John Robert Holmes' line of motors. He's the owner of holmes hobbies. I highly reccomend his Handwound 540 and cobalt puller motors, they're the only motors that I run in my rig, and I've tried several expensive setups, nothing performs like a castle ESC with a holmes hobbies motor. The 35-45 turn handwound 540 motors are wonderful motors, and the 7 turn holmes cobalt motor is the best motor available for a crawler, but it's kind of expensive. The Novak 55 and Tekin 55 turn lathe motors are wonderful motors to start out with, and they're only about $20 brand new. So for $70, you can buy a sidewinder ESC and a nice lathe motor and have a comp capable setup. John Robert Holmes does have some 55 turn handwound 540 motors in stock, I would reccomend them several times over the other brands that I mentioned, his stuff is amazing and unmatched in quality.
http://holmeshobbies.com/product.php?productid=199&cat=0&page=1

You're also going to need a steering servo. I reccomend something with 200 oz/in of torque or better for a crawler. I'm not saying this to sound snoody or brag that my servo is huge, I'm dead serious when I say you need that much torque. You have to use the steering servo to push the whole rig off the side of rocks, and it takes a lot of torque to do that with weighted wheels and soft tires. The Towerpro MG995 is a good servo to start with. It's only about $12 shipped, and puts out 210 oz/in of torque. It's digital, and it performs quite well for the price. I have a few of them, I run them in my spare rigs that I just use to test the parts that I design and build, it's hard to put $120 servos in 5 or 6 crawlers. So I run HiTec 7955 tiatnium gear servos in my comp rigs and my rigs that I take out crawling to relax, and the towerpro servos in my rigs that I just use to test parts on.

Last, you need batteries. What batteries you run will depend on two things, your motor/esc combo, and your charger. With the sidewinder and a lathe motor, I would run an 8 cell saddle pack or 3S LiPo. If you don't have a LiPo charger, you can get a NiMH saddle pack for about $25 brand new, and $10-$15 used. Wait until you decide what motor and ESC you'll be using before getting your battery, some ESC's will only run 7 cell.
http://www.ckrccrawlers.com/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=94_76&products_id=691

And the plates to mount them on, like these
http://www.ckrccrawlers.com/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=692

 

[jfischer]

I have about decided on most of what to get now. Think I am going to go with the Mamba Max controller, and the 3S Lipo setup. I have 2 chargers, and balancers that will do LiPo so should be safe there. Right now am looking at a 1500ma 3S LiPo Battery, figure that should give me 20 minutes or so, depending on the motor.

Just trying to figure out what motor would work well with that.

I have heard volt up and gear down, lets hear what other think on that, and what motor would work well with the setup I have mentioned above.

I am guessing that I wouldn't have a problem with needing to add a different BEC to cut voltage down for my receiver, since that should all be able to be programmed with the USB for that controller. Any running a combo like I am talking about, and having any radio problems, or not enough power for the servo.
Thanks, Jeff

Last, you need batteries. What batteries you run will depend on two things, your motor/esc combo, and your charger. With the sidewinder and a lathe motor, I would run an 8 cell saddle pack or 3S LiPo. If you don't have a LiPo charger, you can get a NiMH saddle pack for about $25 brand new, and $10-$15 used. Wait until you decide what motor and ESC you'll be using before getting your battery, some ESC's will only run 7 cell.

main_page=product_info&products_id=692[/url]

 

[robmob]

I am running a Mamba Max with external Castle BEC and a Maxamps 3S 2000mah lipo batt on my Warthog. Motor is a Holmes Hobbies 7T Cobalt Magnet "Stump Puller". Stock spur and 12t pinion.

Build was just completed so I haven’t got a lot of runs yet, but I did put about half an hour on it at once time this weekend and my low voltage cut off never engaged. I also ran it an additional 15 minutes last night on the same charge and it’s still going.

 

[alpinehyperlite]

the 3S Lipo setup. I have 2 chargers, and balancers that will do LiPo so should be safe there. Right now am looking at a 1500ma 3S LiPo Battery, figure that should give me 20 minutes or so, depending on the motor.
Thanks, Jeff

your looking at closer to like 2 hours or so.

 

[Webbage]

The ARTR is the best Axial there is. No contest. It's a pity the ARTR is better than the kit, Some folks (like me) love building rigs from parts and you can't do that with the ARTR unless you fancy taking it apart and rebuilding it first

I have about decided on most of what to get now. Think I am going to go with the Mamba Max controller

Save yourself some chump change and get a Sidewinder and a CastleLink cable. The Sidewinder is all you need for a crawler, the Mamba Max is really just beefed up to handle high loads for racing. Not really much point for a crawler as the currents etc. are low on the motors. Also if you get a CastleLink cab;le for the Sidewinder it'll mean you can also set he voltage on the CCBEC too. Handy, nyah?

and the 3S Lipo setup. I have 2 chargers, and balancers that will do LiPo so should be safe there. Right now am looking at a 1500ma 3S LiPo Battery, figure that should give me 20 minutes or so, depending on the motor.

If you are going for 3S LiPo you won't need (or want) much more than 900-1000mAh packs. Anything bigger might be a bit lumpy. A 900 mAh will gove you more than 20 mins on a 55T. My 1100 mAh A123s last me about 40 mins of light crawling. On real hard going terrain with lots of climbing and snags they'd probably last me easily over 20 mins.

Just trying to figure out what motor would work well with that.

I have heard volt up and gear down, lets hear what other think on that, and what motor would work well with the setup I have mentioned above.

You will definitely need to gear down for 11.1V. Depends what motor you run where you gear down to. As a measure, on my Axial volting up from 7.2V to 9.9V packs I had to drop 2 teeth on a standard Integy 55T Lathe motor. If you go for a really nice motor like a Holmes 7T Puller then you'll probably have to drop to a 9T or 10T pinion on 11.1V. I will say I prefer a slow, torquey setup with low wheel speed and only have speed on a blip at the very top of my throttle map. What you have is entirely up to you and your driving style

I am guessing that I wouldn't have a problem with needing to add a different BEC to cut voltage down for my receiver, since that should all be able to be programmed with the USB for that controller. Any running a combo like I am talking about, and having any radio problems, or not enough power for the servo.

Get a CC-BEC from Castle. Like I said above, you need a full Castle Link cable to program it. It won't program with the lead from a Mamba Max because the MM has the interface circuitry inboard rather on a lead like the Castle Link. Basically the Mamba Max is a beefed up Sidewinder with the Castle Link built on to the main circuit board of the ESC. The advantage is it is just a simple USB hookup and you don't have to unhook it from the receiver. The disadvantage is you don't get the Castle Link interface to use on other CC electronics.

The CC-BEC is about the best you'll find, and it's 21-23 bucks depending where you buy. It pushes out 10 amps on a 6V supply and will easily ramp down from a 3S LiPo.

It's all good fun and with a well setup ARTR with a few choice mods you'll enjoy it for sure :thumbup:

 

[jfischer]

I would rather go the brushless route, over the brushed, just seems like less work over the years.

I have been looking at Holmes page and their motors, and want something that will turn slow enough, and most brusless seem to be pretty high turn motors.

I have found in the past that with the lower turn brushless they developed a lot of heat, but that was in a heavier vehicle then a 2.2 would be and I was looking for speed then, and am looking for just the opposite with a crawler.

What are you finding that is good for slow crawling, with the torque and still has the wheel speed when needed, (but guess with the 3S LiPo I would have the voltage for the wheel speed, depending on gearing) just looking for something that doesn't get hot as heck, and is or will still be competitive without having to buy 10 motors to find one that works, and would be nice to work with standar 1/8 pinions, as I have a ton of them.

Jeff

 

[alpinehyperlite]

I just use the novac rooster crawler setup, it has a novac rooster esc and 55t brushed motor. i have mine on a 2s lipo. Not good wheel speed, like 5-7 mph, but it lasts forever, and have plenty of torque and no pause from forward to reverse back to forward.

 

[Webbage]

I would rather go the brushless route, over the brushed, just seems like less work over the years.

I have been looking at Holmes page and their motors, and want something that will turn slow enough, and most brusless seem to be pretty high turn motors.

Because the power throughput and speed of a crawler motor are not that big you are probably not going to be looking at overhauling or re-brushing the motor that often to be honest. Comm wear isn't gonna be a major issue either I wouldn't think.

I have found in the past that with the lower turn brushless they developed a lot of heat, but that was in a heavier vehicle then a 2.2 would be and I was looking for speed then, and am looking for just the opposite with a crawler.

I don't know a whole heap about brushless. I recommended the Cobalt off the back of the fact that every serious comp rig I look at has one in there somewhere. I've even see Super rigs running 2 of them (I forget which axle they used for that - it wasn't a clod as they don't fit AFAIK). Every person I've read from and spoken to about them raves about them, Charlie included. A *lot* of people (again including Charlie) have pulled out NOVAK Goat brushless or similar setups and prefer the Cobalt over those.

I ordered one myself to fit to my rig on the strength of that.

If you want advice on what Brushless setup to choose then e-mail John Robert Holmes. I've been throwing mails back and forth with him for a week or so getting his opinion on what I ought to run, and he's been a ton of help. He competes and tests crawler rigs of all types extensively so he really knows his onions.

What are you finding that is good for slow crawling, with the torque and still has the wheel speed when needed, (but guess with the 3S LiPo I would have the voltage for the wheel speed, depending on gearing) just looking for something that doesn't get hot as heck, and is or will still be competitive without having to buy 10 motors to find one that works, and would be nice to work with standar 1/8 pinions, as I have a ton of them.

Jeff

Crawler motors rarely even get warm. Mine never does.

 

[CharliesTheMan]

I agree with most of what Webbage said. However, I would reccomend the maxamps.com 2000 mah 3S LiPo battery. It's got a much smaller footprint than most of the 1320-1500 stuff out there, and its a stronger battery. Webage is right in that 1000 mah is plenty of battery, BUT, most of the smaller mah batteries don't have a high enough C rating to keep up with the high power brushed or brushless motors, and have problems with overheating and they don't let your power system live up to its full potential.

When I got started, I was strictly brushless and LiPo. I've run two Novak Goat brushless systems, and a Holmes Hobbies revolver and crawlmaster outrunner brushless motors. You can say that I've run the gammet with brushless systems, strictly because I didn't know a lot about crawling and didn't want to go with old school technology. I will tell you this, I was WRONG. The first time that I ran a cobalt puller, both of my Novak Goats when up for sale and I went strictly to Mamba Max ESC's with high power brushed motors. The Cobalt Puller is twice as powerful as any of the brushless setups that I ran, it's way smoother, you can volt up and gear it down lower for smoother low end throttle response, and it has more wheelspeed at the same time.

The brushless outrunner motors are going to give you tons of problems with cogging, especially, with the mamba max or sidewinder ESC. If you're going to go the brushless outrunner route, the castle ESC's are not the best route to go. The combo is really bad about cogging. If you run the outrunner motors, you need to have a Quark Pro Car 33 ESC, which you will be able to find used.

I can't say it enough, you wont find a brushless system that preforms half as well as the right brushed combination. I know where you're coming from, as I was striclty brushless and LiPo, but once faced with the facts, I had to admit I was completely wrong. Also, you aren't going to be replacing brushes with these high end Holmes Hobbies motors. Most guys run them for years and get a new motor before they ever need brushes. I would say at least 90 percent of the crawlers out there running brushed motors, have never worn out the brushes in a motor.

You WILL need an external BEC with the Mamba Max ESC. The stock Mamba Max ESC only puts out 5.1 volts at about 2-3 amps (I believe) which when combined with a high torque servo that you need for crawling, will cause your motor to cut out when you turn the wheels and pull throttle. The Castle external BEC can be set at 6 volts and will run up to 10 amps. If you want to talk to someone who went through weeks of headaches because they didn't have an external BEC with a Castle ESC, talk to "SlowNGreen". He had hell with his system.

If you can afford it, I highly reccomend the Mamba Max over the Sidewinder ESC. It's made of better internal components to run at higher voltages, and will handle 4S LiPo a lot better if you decide to bump it up one day and gear down. The Mamba's are also a lot better about being water resistant, and the price of the Sidewinder and Castle Link programmer together are just a slight bit less than the Mamba Max.

When choosing your battery, you need to be thinking about size. I don't know of a 1500 that will fit in the spaces where you need to put them on your crawler, which is why I mentioned it. The maxamps.com 2000 mah 3S LiPo has the best footprint that I've found, and if you want some other reccomendations I can help you out.

John Robert Holmes has his motors built with standard 540 size pinion shafts, and you can buy the set of pinions with 9-13 tooth (which is what you'll need) in 48 pitch for about 20 bucks. I would try to stick with those pinions as they're cheap and work with the 48 pitch spur gears.

 

[jfischer]

Charlie, one of my biggest problems right now is trying to find one of the ARTR trucks. I wrote RPP (I think that is one you suggested) and they are out like most of the others. I am sure in due time most places will be getting them in.

I agree with most of what Webbage said. However, I would reccomend the maxamps.com 2000 mah 3S LiPo battery. It's got a much smaller footprint than most of the 1320-1500 stuff out there, and its a stronger battery. Webage is right in that 1000 mah is plenty of battery, BUT, most of the smaller mah batteries don't have a high enough C rating to keep up with the high power brushed or brushless motors, and have problems with overheating and they don't let your power system live up to its full potential.

Charlie, I agree totally on you needing more power in a LiPo setup for the motor you are using. Seems the 7T does pull more then a lot of the others, and described on John Robert Holmes as " Recommended lipo battery- 40 amps continuous for 11.1v, 30 amps continuous for 7.4v. "

Here is you one, where are you mounting a 2000 to try to keep the COG down on the crawler. Most do seem to be too big to mount on the axle, even with a custom made plate to mount it.

When I got started, I was strictly brushless and LiPo. I've run two Novak Goat brushless systems, and a Holmes Hobbies revolver and crawlmaster outrunner brushless motors. You can say that I've run the gammet with brushless systems, strictly because I didn't know a lot about crawling and didn't want to go with old school technology. I will tell you this, I was WRONG. The first time that I ran a cobalt puller, both of my Novak Goats when up for sale and I went strictly to Mamba Max ESC's with high power brushed motors. The Cobalt Puller is twice as powerful as any of the brushless setups that I ran, it's way smoother, you can volt up and gear it down lower for smoother low end throttle response, and it has more wheelspeed at the same time.

The brushless outrunner motors are going to give you tons of problems with cogging, especially, with the mamba max or sidewinder ESC. If you're going to go the brushless outrunner route, the castle ESC's are not the best route to go. The combo is really bad about cogging. If you run the outrunner motors, you need to have a Quark Pro Car 33 ESC, which you will be able to find used.

I can't say it enough, you wont find a brushless system that preforms half as well as the right brushed combination. I know where you're coming from, as I was striclty brushless and LiPo, but once faced with the facts, I had to admit I was completely wrong. Also, you aren't going to be replacing brushes with these high end Holmes Hobbies motors. Most guys run them for years and get a new motor before they ever need brushes. I would say at least 90 percent of the crawlers out there running brushed motors, have never worn out the brushes in a motor.

The more I read about the 7T Colbalt motor the more I like, except for it pulling so much power, and giving you the shorter run times with it. I have been reading a few things where John Robert Holmes is working with making a brushless sensored, and that should stop a lot of the cogging with them. I guess if you wait long enough anything is possible.

I do have one of the Quark 33 Pro ESC in a Assoicated 18R car I race, and it is a smooth controller, only problem is, they are not making them right now, and you would have to find a used one, and like all I have read about the Mamba Max a lot better, and think it is worth the money to go with it.

I guess the other question is, where are you finding all of this stuff used at. I always seem to be a day late when I find them, if at all.

You WILL need an external BEC with the Mamba Max ESC. The stock Mamba Max ESC only puts out 5.1 volts at about 2-3 amps (I believe) which when combined with a high torque servo that you need for crawling, will cause your motor to cut out when you turn the wheels and pull throttle. The Castle external BEC can be set at 6 volts and will run up to 10 amps. If you want to talk to someone who went through weeks of headaches because they didn't have an external BEC with a Castle ESC, talk to "SlowNGreen". He had hell with his system.

If you can afford it, I highly reccomend the Mamba Max over the Sidewinder ESC. It's made of better internal components to run at higher voltages, and will handle 4S LiPo a lot better if you decide to bump it up one day and gear down. The Mamba's are also a lot better about being water resistant, and the price of the Sidewinder and Castle Link programmer together are just a slight bit less than the Mamba Max.

When choosing your battery, you need to be thinking about size. I don't know of a 1500 that will fit in the spaces where you need to put them on your crawler, which is why I mentioned it. The maxamps.com 2000 mah 3S LiPo has the best footprint that I've found, and if you want some other reccomendations I can help you out.

John Robert Holmes has his motors built with standard 540 size pinion shafts, and you can buy the set of pinions with 9-13 tooth (which is what you'll need) in 48 pitch for about 20 bucks. I would try to stick with those pinions as they're cheap and work with the 48 pitch spur gears.

I will go with the external BEC. From what all I have been reading, it really does need the straight 6 volts when you get to turning a big servo, and I can see where that, and a burst of the motor would really be taxing and need the extra power. I have also found a few diagrams on wiring it in a different method then I have before, which should help out.

I left John Robert Holmes a regular e-mail message asking about a few things, maybe when he finds the time he will answer it.

I have a pretty good selection of the 48 pitch gears now from my racing days with stadium trucks, and think I have that all covered.

 

[CharliesTheMan]

The Maxamps.com 2000 mah 3S LiPo battery fits perfectly on a plate on the front upper links. I'm also designing a custom battery plate that will allow the customer (and me as well lol) to mount a larger battery than is currently available with anything on the market, which is achieved by drastically changing the design. However, for right now, the 2000 mah works great mounted on the upper links.

I made a plate out of lexan and attached it to the upper links

This is the battery
http://maxamps.com/proddetail.php?prod=Lipo-2000-111-Pack&cat=82

I use the Axial low COG battery/servo mount on the axle, and I mount my electronics up there on that plate.

You don't have to worry about short run times when using the battery above. I'm getting an hour and a half of crawl time with the battery shown above, paired with a Mamba Max ESC, HiTec 7955tg (333 oz/in), and Castle Creations BEC set at 6 volts.

I will help you find an Axial ARTR. Some of the vendors do still have some, so I'll do some searching in just a little while. I should have some coming in next week as well, through the crawler store that I partnered up with, www.eastendmachining.com.

I have some cobalt pullers on the way from John Robert Holmes, and if you want one just let me know and I'll hold one for you when they come in. I also carry Castle Creations products, so if you would like to order through us at East End Machining, we will take good care of you. We offer free shipping on orders over $75 as well.

I have found that the best way to get in touch with John Robert is by calling his business line during the week. He's a great guy to deal with an is very honest. Not many people will be honest like he is with their products. I called to order one of his outrunners, and he actually advised me not to buy it because of the cogging issues. I work REALLY hard at my customer service, so to find someone doing the same goes a long way with me. When you call him, you can ask him lots of stuff and let him explain it, instead of going back and fourth with email.

Is there anything else that isn't listed above that you need me to help you find?

I want to congratulate you. I can tell that you've been doing A LOT of reaserch, and you've kept a very open mind with everything and soaked it up like a sponge. It's so refreshing to help someone who asks for help and then actually listens. So many people these days like to ask for help, and then argue with me when I answer the questions that they asked me to help them with. You've obviously been educating yourself a lot, and with your experience with racing and things like that, you're going to pick up this crawling stuff like there's no tomorrow.

 

[CharliesTheMan]

This is a great company to deal with. There are several more on ebay, but this is the company that I have ordered A LOT of stuff from. I've probably spent $5000 with them in the past year, and I've never had a single problem.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Axial-AX10-Scor...39:1|66:2|65:12|240:1318&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14

UPDATE: I also found out that X-treme RC has some in stock. Another company that I've done business with in the past

Is it just me, or does my crawler appear to have trimmed pubic hair?