Kyosho Ultima and nostalgia question!!

[Goose246]

Well nostalgia and funds is a bad combination!!

I would love some advice from you Kyosho afficianados!

So.. when I was a teenager in late 80’s / early 90’s we didn’t have much so there was no possible way I could have ever had the Kyosho Ultima . Fast forward 30 some odd years.. I see kyosho re released an ultima kit recently!

Over the past few years I’ve bought several , Traxxas and Arrmas, but I find myself wanting that kit! So here’s the question … I’d like to keep it authentic with a brushed motor.. (but modern one).. but I’d love some advice on motor, esc, and rx. Since I already have traxxas iq transmitter should I put Traxxas stuff in the kyosho or is that sacrelegious??

And and all advice for someone who was never built a kyosho but very much looking forward to it would be greatly appreciated!

 

[Mick Boomer]

Keep it brushed and enjoy the nostalgia. There are some nice brushed motors out there. Check out holmes hobbies.

 

[Goose246]

Keep it brushed and enjoy the nostalgia. There are some nice brushed motors out there. Check out holmes hobbies.

Yes, I would like to keep it brushed, but I don’t know the first thing about buying anything that hasn’t been ready to run like Arma and Traxxas, I would love some advice on what kind of motor, receiver, etc. All I know is it takes a 540. I do plan on using a 2S Lipo with it.

 

[WickedFog]

First of all, welcome to RCT.

Just an intro, here's our Ultima we just built. Nothing nostalgic here but the kit itself.

If you are going for nostalgia, don't go with anything but the Kyosho motor and ESC. First and foremost, the kit was designed to use Kyosho electronics. All their kits were back then. Other stuff will fit for sure, but some mods will likely need to be made, as was the case with our build.

And if you really want to keep with the Nostalgia theme, you should put a Futaba radio in it. Kyosho and Futaba were like no brainers back then.

The build is fairly straightforward, but I would suggest digging every screw and nut out of every bag and sorting them by size into parts trays. Ours was challenging trying to find which bag had which screws. Open bag C, but the screws you need are in bag F. It was pretty frustrating. Maybe our kit was packed by a blind person. I don't know. But if I built another one, I'd just dump every bag and sort it all before I started the build.

The Ultima is a great kit, but not my fav. These are much better Kyosho kits (for a number of reasons)...

 

[Goose246]

Thank you for the welcome! There’s just something about the Ultima that brings back nostalgia! Thank you for the advice on the screw sorting. In regards to Kyosho motor and speed control, does Kyosho make modern 540s and speed controls ? And if so any recommendations? Forgive my naivety, but I haven’t even seen Akio show since 1992 in person ha ha

 

[WickedFog]

Yeah, they still make their own electronics. If you go here, you can download the build manual. In it, it will list recommended electronics for brushed and brushless setups.
https://kyoshoamerica.com/30625.html

Oh, and one cool thing. Kyosho manuals list all the Option House upgrade parts that were/are available.

 

[Goose246]

Yeah, they still make their own electronics. If you go here, you can download the build manual. In it, it will list recommended electronics for brushed and brushless setups.
https://kyoshoamerica.com/30625.html

Oh, and one cool thing. Kyosho manuals list all the Option House upgrade parts that were/are available.

That is perfect! Thank you for sharing that info. Would you also recommend Kyosho transmitter and receiver?

 

[WickedFog]

https://kyoshoamerica.com/82143.html

I see this link on the Kyosho America website for the starter pack with radio, motor, receiver, and speed control. When I look for it in other places, it says discontinued. Anyone have any idea if this is still something kyosho show themselves carry?

I don't remember Kyosho having their own radio system back then. It was just Futaba that guys were using, and Kyosho actually preferred Futaba stuff back then (and I think now even). If I wasn't going Futaba, and I wanted a budget radio, then I'd get the Flysky GT3B. You won't find a better radio in the budget market. Most of the guys here have at least one GT3

The GT3B takes 8 AA batteries. You can buy Panasonic Eneloop Pro rechargeables and they will last through a number of battery packs before you need to recharge them. It's my favorite thing about the GT3B.

 

[Goose246]

I don't remember Kyosho having their own radio system back then. It was just Futaba that guys were using, and Kyosho actually preferred Futaba stuff back then (and I think now even). If I wasn't going Futaba, and I wanted a budget radio, then I'd get the Flysky GT3B. You won't find a better radio in the budget market. Most of the guys here have at least one GT3

Fantastic that’s the info I was hoping for! Kyosho motor and esc good though?

 

[bill_delong]

If you're willing to put a modern brushed ESC in it then you might as well install a mild brushless combo. Since you plan to run LiPo that will eliminate any classic brushed ESC because they don't have a LVC.

There really is no point running brushed anymore, but here's some options to consider:

Brushed Combo:
https://www.amazon.com/Surpass-5-Slot-Brushed-Program-Crawler/dp/B07TX91848

This has replacement brushes and an 11T option which is close to what racers ran back in the day, plus it has a program card which you can't get from Traxxas



Brushless Combo:
https://www.amazon.com/GoolRC-Surpass-4370KV-Brushless-Waterproof/dp/B07RMJDCYS

This is what I would run if it were me, you want a mild system with the finned motor that is a true 360 can so it won't blow out the drive train. It will be far more efficient offering cooler temps and longer run times than what the brushed motor will offer, plus you wont have brushes to break in or replace


I've had better luck with Radiolink over the FlySky GT3B and GT3C:
https://www.amazon.com/Radiolink-2-4GHz-Transmitter-Receiver-Controller/dp/B07DPMVVKN

Note that Radiolink includes a gyro which will help counter steer to make the car easier to drift on loose dirt, more info here:

More info here on the radiolink covering most of the key features where it offers more channel mixing capability than any other system in this price range:

 

[WickedFog]

Fantastic that’s the info I was hoping for! Kyosho motor and esc good though?

They always were. But one thing you should know is brushed motors aren't great for anything with speed. Brushes wear out, the dust from the wearing brushes builds up in them, etc. Kyosho has brushless setups too, so it would still be cool for nostalgia's sake. It's just if you went brushless, you'd be much better off.

Brushless Combo:
https://www.amazon.com/GoolRC-Surpass-4370KV-Brushless-Waterproof/dp/B07RMJDCYS

That motor will not fit (I don't think). The motor wires coming out the side like that will put you in a mess of trouble trying to figure out how to get the motor in, and get the wires out to route around the side of the transmission housing. There is literally no room inside the motor cage for anything but the motor case, and adjustment room for gearset.

I had to grind the support bracket, and grind off one of the motor lugs on my Castle motor to get it in there, and I still don't like the clearance.

 

[Goose246]

Well… I didn’t even think about the lcv with kyosho receiver….

Hmmm… would it make sense then to use Traxxas 540 motor, esc and reciever?? It’s a brushed motor but wondering if that might be an easy reliable solution

 

[WickedFog]

Well… I didn’t even think about the lcv with kyosho receiver….

Hmmm… would it make sense then to use Traxxas 540 motor, esc and reciever?? It’s a brushed motor but wondering if that might be an easy reliable solution

Yes... that's sacrilegious

 

[Goose246]

Yes... that's sacrilegious

I had a feeling ha ha

 

[bill_delong]

That motor will not fit (I don't think). The motor wires coming out the side like that will put you in a mess of trouble trying to figure out how to get the motor in, and get the wires out to route around the side of the transmission housing. There is literally no room inside the motor cage for anything but the motor case, and adjustment room for gearset.

I had to grind the support bracket, and grind off one of the motor lugs on my Castle motor to get it in there, and I still don't like the clearance.

There are tons of mounting holes on the motor to rotate it so the wires are angled in any direction you need, here's an example from Big Squid showing how there's plenty of room to mount most brushless combos without any grinding or modification necessary:

*** EDIT ***
While reviewing that article I noticed that they upgraded the drive train to handle modern brushless systems!
https://www.bigsquidrc.com/coming-soon-kyosho-ultima-buggy-re-release/

The re-release of the Ultima does sport a few changes to bring it up to speed with modern power systems. Reinforced gearbox internals are used along with a slipper clutch, metals gears, and a durable differential to help the re-release Ultima keep up with today’s brushless power systems. Also new are updated shock towers, red shocks, as well as a new wing mount.

 

[WickedFog]

There are tons of mounting holes on the motor to rotate it so the wires are angled in any direction you need, here's an example from Big Squid showing how there's plenty of room to mount most brushless combos without any grinding or modification necessary:

View attachment 160496

View attachment 160497


*** EDIT ***
While reviewing that article I noticed that they upgraded the drive train to handle modern brushless systems!
https://www.bigsquidrc.com/coming-soon-kyosho-ultima-buggy-re-release/

Mine didn't allow for a more forward rotation of the motor. I don't need to look at Big Squid. I built mine. And that pic at Big Squid doesn't show you how tight the mounting area is. Where I mounted mine was the only option. The front wire mount ran into the transmission housing if I tried rotating to the next hole. So that whole "any rotation you need" thing is dependant on the motor mounting hole orientation. Had mine had the holes clocked just a few degrees differently, it would have been perfect. The motor you show there can only be timed every 60°. That is a lot of rotation to try to fit the wiring harnes in a gap not much bigger than the wiring harness. Oh, and the wiring harness in the Big Squid pic isn't even routed properly anyway

 

[bill_delong]

Mine didn't allow for a more forward rotation of the motor. I don't need to look at Big Squid. I built mine. And that pic at Big Squid doesn't show you how tight the mounting area is. Where I mounted mine was the only option. The front wire mount ran into the transmission housing if I tried rotating to the next hole. So that whole "any rotation you need" thing is dependant on the motor mounting hole orientation. Had mine had the holes clocked just a few degrees differently, it would have been perfect. The motor you show there can only be timed every 60°. That is a lot of rotation to try to fit the wiring harnes in a gap not much bigger than the wiring harness. Oh, and the wiring harness in the Big Squid pic isn't even routed properly anyway

Yeah I see how the motor shifts 60° for every pair of holes, but there seems to be somewhere between 60°-80° between the suspension arm up to the roll cage which has me thinking that it will work perfectly fine for most modern brushless systems which the OEM has specifically designed this car to handle

 

[WickedFog]

Yeah I see how the motor shifts 60° for every pair of holes, but there seems to be somewhere between 60°-80° between the suspension arm up to the roll cage which has me thinking that it will work perfectly fine for most modern brushless systems which the OEM has specifically designed this car to handle

Well, it may fit with that motor, depending on where that wiring harness is from the motor plate. You can remove the wiring harness clamp and gain more room. I opted to keep mine tidy, and per the instruction manual.

 

[Goose246]

Any update on concensus if brushless motor will fit ?

 

[Greywolf74]

It will fit. How much of a tight squeeze it is and how you have to run the motor wires may depend on the motor. Wicked did make his Castle brushless motor fit and Big Squid made one fit so it is doable.