Old School Twisters Motor Specifications - help

[JCsRCcar]

First off hi everyone - new to this forum obviously. I’m an old man now but my 11 year old son received a 4wd Traxxas Slash. Since I wanted him to have someone to run his car with, I purchased a 2wd Rustler for myself to run with him, lol. They both come with the 12 turn brushed motors and are a blast to drive.

Way back in the early 90’s I was big into 1/10th scale RC cars. Brushed motors was all there was and you had modified and stock motors. We also had manual servo controlled speed controllers, lol. A lot has changed since then but I’m glad to see the hobbie is still alive. My question is this; I have an old vintage Twisters modified brushed motor that I want to try in one of these cars, but Traxxas says the XL5 ESC is only good for a 12 turn motor or more. I have a feeling this Twisters modified brushed motor is much less than 12 turns, but I can't find any information on it?

I am fully aware that a brushless setup could be better and more reliable but I really wanted to just try this modified twisters motor out first. Back when I ran this motor it was faster than anything else I ran against. I used to win all the races at my local events 30 years ago. BTW, I didnt do the crappy soldering job on this motor. I bought it used like this but it does work good.

My other question is if the XL5 ESC can't be safely used then where can I get a brushed ESC that can handle a low turn modified brushed motor?

Thanks,

John

 

[Greywolf74]

I remember those days of mechanical speedos and brushed motors. I mean I was a kid back then playing with my Tamiya Frog but I do remember those days. I also remember burning myself many many times on that stupid ceramic resistor on the back of the kit lol. That looks like an old 701 or 702 twister cyclone but I can't swear to it and even if I could I can't find any specs on it. In fact I think back in the 80s they didnt even rate motors the same as they do today, did they? I seem to recall ratings like 17x2 and 14x2 etc but again I was young so maybe I dont recall correctly but I digress...

The only thing I would say is I probably wouldnt try to run it. Not so much worried about the ESC (although that is a bit of a concern too) but I worried about the motor itself. Regardless of whether it a low turn rated motor or not I'm afraid you're just going to burn the motor up. That can is only half the length of the titan 12T thats in it now. That means that its not going to have sufficient torque to move the kit without heating up very rapidly. If it is a real low turn motor then that is going to be even more true and then you are also risking the speedo.

If you just have to try it I can recommend an ESC but my prediction is youd buy the ESC, motor not going to be practical to use and then youve just wasted your money on a better brushed ESC that you'll have no use for after that. My .02 is just to run it as is or go brushless.

 

[JCsRCcar]

Thank you for the insight @Graywolf74 .

So I went and installed this Twisters motor on a Traxxas Rustler that came with a Titan 12T motor and did some timed before and after comparison runs. With the Titan it did an average of 5.56 seconds and with the Twisters it did an average of 4.84 seconds in the same distance. All this was done with the stock 16/90 gearing which I think is easy on the TL-5 ESC. I did an average of three runs each and wheel spin was an issue with both motors but the runs were consistent. I dont think this Twisters motor is the low turn modified monster I thought it was but it is faster and the TL-5 ESC didn’t get the least bit warm with either motor. The Twisters motor did seam to get a little hotter but I didn't measure the difference.

I’ll keep the Twisters on for now and if it blows up then I‘ll get a Traxxas brushless setup and give that to my son for his 4x4 Slash and I’ll take his old Titan TL-5 combo to replace mine. Traxxas also offers a good trade in program for their brushless motors.

 

[Greywolf74]

If the twisted motor is working good then its prolly gonna be better in the long run cuz those titan 12Ts are known for being cheap pieces of crap. Never owned one but I've seen a lot of them give up the ghost fairly quickly for a lot of folks. Just grab a temp gun and keep an eye on the ESC and motor temps.

 

[JCsRCcar]

I think so and I will be checking the temps. I was just reading that I may need some small ceramic capacitors on the plus and negative side of the motor to help prevent radio interference from the brushes arcing on the Armature?

 

[D3MON]

I think so and I will be checking the temps. I was just reading that I may need some small ceramic capacitors on the plus and negative side of the motor to help prevent radio interference from the brushes arcing on the Armature?

with the day and age of 2.4ghz i don't think that is required anymore, with 27mhz i remember that being the case though.
i do also recommend upgrading to brushless as greywolf said when the brushed motors give up the ghost if it is feasible.
imo though the traxxas electronics are pretty expensive for what they are and pretty common for them to run warm.
for the 2wd id go with something like the hobbywing max10 combo, 3300kv or possibly even the 4000kv, just remember lower KV means less top speed but more torque which will take less amp draw, higher KV means higher speed, but lower torque so will draw more amps. its also alot easier to gear up, can only gear down so far.
for teh 4wd I'm sure the max10 would be ok, but id probably recommend something like the Max10SCT combo.

 

[JCsRCcar]

Thanks D3MON, I will check that out. Traxxas does offer a decent credit if you trade in the stock Titan and ESC for their brushless setup with 3500 kv for $125. Thats not bad by comparison I guess.

I’m also going to remove the Twisters motor. It’s definitely faster but it heats up more too so not worth risking it.

 

[Greywolf74]

Thanks D3MON, I will check that out. Traxxas does offer a decent credit if you trade in the stock Titan and ESC for their brushless setup with 3500 kv for $125. Thats not bad by comparison I guess.

I’m also going to remove the Twisters motor. It’s definitely faster but it heats up more too so not worth risking it.

The traxxas brushless system is ok and by ok I mean the motor is pretty solid the ESC is junk imo. Pretty sure a lot of people feel that way about that combo. That being said if you're on a tight budget its hard to beat $125 upgrade to start with. If moneys not as much of an issue and you just want quality then Id personally throw the Castle Creations Coppehead 10 ESC and 3200kv SCT motor in it which can be found HERE. Hobbywing is a good middle ground. Theyre better than stock Traxxas but not as good as Castle but the price reflects that too. Not trying to bash on what D3mon suggested though dont get me wrong. Just puttin my opinion out there

 

[D3MON]

just to put out there food for thought, the VLX-3s is supposed to be 320amp peak with a non-disclosed constant amp rating, the Hobbywing max10 (non SCT version) is 60amp constant, with a 450Amp peak. , the Max10SCT combo is 120amp constant, and 830amp peak.
going off amazon prices,
HW Max10 combo is around 101$,
HW Max10SCT combo is 144$
TRX VXL3s combo is 170$

 

[Greywolf74]

just to put out there food for thought, the VLX-3s is supposed to be 320amp peak with a non-disclosed constant amp rating, the Hobbywing max10 (non SCT version) is 60amp constant, with a 450Amp peak. , the Max10SCT combo is 120amp constant, and 830amp peak.
going off amazon prices,
HW Max10 combo is around 101$,
HW Max10SCT combo is 144$
TRX VXL3s combo is 170$

This is a little off topic D3mon but I have to say HW does look like theyve upped their game since the last time I've used their stuff which admittedly has probably been 6, 7, 8 years ago at this point. might have to do a HW build again one of these days just to check out their new stuff.

 

[D3MON]

This is a little off topic D3mon but I have to say HW does look like theyve upped their game since the last time I've used their stuff which admittedly has probably been 6, 7, 8 years ago at this point. might have to do a HW build again one of these days just to check out their new stuff.

I've had some HW stuff and been super pleased with it, and many of the current components are rebranded/programmed HW, including the spektrum, BLX new Redcat electronics and so on. i remember when they were first kind of coming up they seemed to be kind of questionably cheap, but i never had the chance to try them back then, this was around 12 years or so ago though.
i really like how they have multiple offerings to cater to about any level, their quicrun for budget, EZrun for bashers, and the Xerun for sensored competition/racing applications.

 

[cbaker65]

First off hi everyone - new to this forum obviously. I’m an old man now but my 11 year old son received a 4wd Traxxas Slash. Since I wanted him to have someone to run his car with, I purchased a 2wd Rustler for myself to run with him, lol. They both come with the 12 turn brushed motors and are a blast to drive.

Way back in the early 90’s I was big into 1/10th scale RC cars. Brushed motors was all there was and you had modified and stock motors. We also had manual servo controlled speed controllers, lol. A lot has changed since then but I’m glad to see the hobbie is still alive. My question is this; I have an old vintage Twisters modified brushed motor that I want to try in one of these cars, but Traxxas says the XL5 ESC is only good for a 12 turn motor or more. I have a feeling this Twisters modified brushed motor is much less than 12 turns, but I can't find any information on it?

I am fully aware that a brushless setup could be better and more reliable but I really wanted to just try this modified twisters motor out first. Back when I ran this motor it was faster than anything else I ran against. I used to win all the races at my local events 30 years ago. BTW, I didnt do the crappy soldering job on this motor. I bought it used like this but it does work good.

My other question is if the XL5 ESC can't be safely used then where can I get a brushed ESC that can handle a low turn modified brushed motor?

Thanks,

John

Those modified Twister motors were bad boys in their time ,however ,they zapped the power quick ,
but could use a Lipo battery I think!
I loved my Losi Jr2 with the mod Twister motor it was fast ,but those should have those glitch busters
soldered to them on the end bell ,you also have to pull them apart an clean the armature up every now
an then an lube the bearings ,change the brushes ,so they have to be maintained!..

It might be best just to change over to brushless ,just a 2's lipo set up is plenty for those 2 wheel drive
slashes ,heck ,the 2's lipo brushless was even plenty of power for the 4x4 class trucks as well!..

 

[Greywolf74]

I've had some HW stuff and been super pleased with it, and many of the current components are rebranded/programmed HW, including the spektrum, BLX new Redcat electronics and so on. i remember when they were first kind of coming up they seemed to be kind of questionably cheap, but i never had the chance to try them back then, this was around 12 years or so ago though.
i really like how they have multiple offerings to cater to about any level, their quicrun for budget, EZrun for bashers, and the Xerun for sensored competition/racing applications.

I've still got an EZRun SC8 in one of my Rustlers from about 12 years ago. Still works. The main thing to me is they need to get programming options for their ESCs like Castle and Tekin do. Where you can use a computer and set throttle and breaking curves etc. Thats probably the biggest reason I stopped using them.

 

[JCsRCcar]

Thanks guys for all the suggestions, I’ll definitely use this thread and your suggestions for reference when the time comes to upgrade. I wish I could remember the brand car I had when I was a kid but it was so long ago now. I just remember it was a buggy and when I upgraded the stock motor to the modified twister motor with red case and 8.4 volt battery it was a rocket. It may have been Team Associated. Those look very high qaulity now and their price reflects that too.

My son is having a blast with his new Slash 4x4 and to be honest the cheap Traxxas 2WD Rustler I purchased to run with him is actually really good and quick for a $200 RC car. He has been taking his Slash apart and putting parts back together on his own and researching upgrades on his own. Last week I got him the anti-sway bar kit and he was pretty excited about that. Two days ago he broke the center drive shaft so we upgraded to an aluminum one. Today we picked up some GTR shocks and 50 wt oil to try out on the back because it sometimes bottoms out on jumps with the stock shocks and springs.

He currently has three 2-cell 7600 mAh Lipo batteries and one 7-cell 3000 mAh NiMh battery and they last a long time too and all are made by Traxxas with a Traxxas dual battery iD charger. I’m guessing that I should have probably just purchased two 2-cell Lipo batteries and a 3-cell Lipo for later but at the time I didn't know any different.

Please keep the suggestions coming.

 

[Greywolf74]

Thanks guys for all the suggestions, I’ll definitely use this thread and your suggestions for reference when the time comes to upgrade. I wish I could remember the brand car I had when I was a kid but it was so long ago now. I just remember it was a buggy and when I upgraded the stock motor to the modified twister motor with red case and 8.4 volt battery it was a rocket. It may have been Team Associated. Those look very high qaulity now and their price reflects that too.

My son is having a blast with his new Slash 4x4 and to be honest the cheap Traxxas 2WD Rustler I purchased to run with him is actually really good and quick for a $200 RC car. He has been taking his Slash apart and putting parts back together on his own and researching upgrades on his own. Last week I got him the anti-sway bar kit and he was pretty excited about that. Two days ago he broke the center drive shaft so we upgraded to an aluminum one. Today we picked up some GTR shocks and 50 wt oil to try out on the back because it sometimes bottoms out on jumps with the stock shocks and springs.

He currently has three 2-cell 7600 mAh Lipo batteries and one 7-cell 3000 mAh NiMh battery and they last a long time too and all are made by Traxxas with a Traxxas dual battery iD charger. I’m guessing that I should have probably just purchased two 2-cell Lipo batteries and a 3-cell Lipo for later but at the time I didn't know any different.

Please keep the suggestions coming.

I agree the the Rustler is a great little car. I have two of em. One of them I have set up to do 100+MPH speed runs on it and the other one is a normal one except its got a ton of after market hop ups on it

 

[JCsRCcar]

We add some cooling fans with heat sinks from the local hobby shop to the motors today and they seem to have made a very big difference in how cool they run now. The Rustler was cool to the touch and my sons Slash was barely warm. Pretty good way to reduce temperature I think for $10-$12.

Edit: forgot to mention we added the GTR shocks to the rear of the slash and added 50 wt oil all the way around with stiffer springs in the rear. It ended up too stiff so then we swapped the stiffer springs out for softer ones and I think its perfect now. We just added 50 wt oil to the rear Rustler shocks and it handles perfect now. I can drift this thing so easily in the dirt. My son did all the work himself and he’s pretty proud of that.

 

[Greywolf74]

We add some cooling fans with heat sinks from the local hobby shop to the motors today and they seem to have made a very big difference in how cool they run now. The Rustler was cool to the touch and my sons Slash was barely warm. Pretty good way to reduce temperature I think for $10-$12.

Edit: forgot to mention we added the GTR shocks to the rear of the slash and added 50 wt oil all the way around with stiffer springs in the rear. It ended up too stiff so then we swapped the stiffer springs out for softer ones and I think its perfect now. We just added 50 wt oil to the rear Rustler shocks and it handles perfect now. I can drift this thing so easily in the dirt. My son did all the work himself and he’s pretty proud of that.

Awesome!

 

[JCsRCcar]

Anyone have a solution to stop sand that gets into the drive shaft and spur gear. It is damaging the teeth on the spur gear and scratching up the drive shaft. I’m thinking of getting this inner fender to help reduce the amount of debris that gets inside the chassis and also covering up the small opening that allows sand to enter the drive shaft from underneath the chassis. https://www.ebay.com/itm/Traxxas-Slash-4x4-LCG-inner-mudguard-fender-wells-/174039005806

 

[Greywolf74]

Anyone have a solution to stop sand that gets into the drive shaft and spur gear. It is damaging the teeth on the spur gear and scratching up the drive shaft. I’m thinking of getting this inner fender to help reduce the amount of debris that gets inside the chassis and also covering up the small opening that allows sand to enter the drive shaft from underneath the chassis. https://www.ebay.com/itm/Traxxas-Slash-4x4-LCG-inner-mudguard-fender-wells-/174039005806

That should help a lot or at least it looks like it would

 

[JCsRCcar]

I tried to purchase it but its not available in the US. O-well.