Best motor upgrade for 1/0th scale short course truck

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RC MAN

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Hi guys


I've been looking for a great brushless motor upgrade for my 1/10 scale short course truck. I think iv'e settled on one of these
https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/174738033744?hash=item28af32cc50:g:4JAAAOSwUgJgfPMg
or
https://www.amazon.com/Vehicles-OCS...10+brushless+motor&qid=1624077878&sr=8-6&th=1
or
maybe https://www.amazon.com/RCRunning-59...+rc+car+brushless+motor&qid=1624078264&sr=8-8.

The first one says it will pull a max 100amps and make 1200watts of power so i am kind of leaning towards that one [because more watts of power = speed doesn't it] But it would be good for a second opinion. And if any of you guys have a better motor in mind i am open to suggestions.

Thanks in advance
 
Is your SCT 2wd or 4wd? If 2wd, then a 3650 sized motor would be fine, but if 4wd, it may lack torque and run hot. Also, have you decided your kv range, and battery you are going to run (they are also factors you should put in mind when selecting a motor)? In general, higher kv motors allow you to go faster with relatively less voltage, while lower kv motors require higher voltages to reach the same speed, but outputs more torque.
I am running the CC SW4 1410 3800kv combo in my Slash 2wd with the stock gearing, and it seems to run reliably, cool, and smooth on 2s. If I were to choose a combo for my Slash 4x4, I would pick the CC CH 1412 3200kv LE, since it is sensored and can take all the way up to 4s.
Other good options include the Hobbywing Max10, Hobbywing Max10 SCT, etc (still plenty more, but that's I can come up with atm, you can ask for more options if these aren't really what you are looking for).
 
it is a 2wd and i am planning to run it on a 5000mah 50c 11.1v battery.
so you wouldn’t recommend the first one because it seems to make the most watts and in the biggest can size?

and also is more watts and amps going to make my rig faster.

thanks again
 
to many cell to run all of those motors those are 2 cell only motors.. if you do run any of these on 3 cells video it I love a good smoke show ...people need to know how many kv to run with each cell. There are known limits from US that have been in this hobby for decades
 
Hi guys


I've been looking for a great brushless motor upgrade for my 1/10 scale short course truck. I think iv'e settled on one of these
https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/174738033744?hash=item28af32cc50:g:4JAAAOSwUgJgfPMg
or
https://www.amazon.com/Vehicles-OCS-Surpass-6900KV-Brushless-Children/dp/B08B8P274N/ref=sr_1_6?dchild=1&keywords=Surpass+Hobby+1/10+brushless+motor&qid=1624077878&sr=8-6&th=1
or
maybe https://www.amazon.com/RCRunning-5900KV-3-175mm-Waterproof-Brushless/dp/B074MWR1ZV/ref=sr_1_8?dchild=1&keywords=1/10+rc+car+brushless+motor&qid=1624078264&sr=8-8.

The first one says it will pull a max 100amps and make 1200watts of power so i am kind of leaning towards that one [because more watts of power = speed doesn't it] But it would be good for a second opinion. And if any of you guys have a better motor in mind i am open to suggestions.

Thanks in advance
TNT is right, none of those motors are going to hold up under 3S lipo and the 2 higher KV motors are not really appropriate for a 1/10 scale SCT, even 2WD ones. The 4200kv would be ok on 2S with reasonable gearing. Id say get a Castle 3800 or 3200kv motor but I'm guessing from your choices you're budget wouldnt allow for that so Id probably look at getting something like THIS.

As for the wattage ratings, I wouldnt pay to much attention to that. Firstly wattage ratings between different manufacturers are going to vary widely. Secondly depends on how energy efficient the motor is. You can have two identical kv motors with identical Amp/Wattage draws (lets just say 1000W to make the math easier) and if one of them is 70% efficient then 300W out of that 1000W is getting turned in to heat instead of usable power. 300W is a ton of heat. Imagine your 50-60W soldering station and how hot that can get. Not a direct comparison I know but it amplifies the point. If the other motor is 85% efficient then only 150W of power is getting turned to heat and would therefore be a more powerful motor.

Gauss strength (how powerful the magnets are) also play a big part in how fast/powerful a motor is too. The stronger the magnets the better but unless you're racing Gauss strength really isnt that important and really neither is the efficiency if you're just bashing. Efficiency you can sometimes find listed with a motors specs but Gauss strength not so much. They make Gauss testers and efficiency testers etc that you can buy and compare motors, heck they even have RC dynos now a days, but again if you aint racing you're prolly not going to spend the money on the test equipment.

Just stick with known good brands and try to pick an appropriate KV rating, lipo cell count, and motor size for your application and you'll be fine.
 
I would get a 540 2 pole motor that is around 3300kv which would be well suited for 3S. If you want the vehicle more overpowered than get a 540 4 pole motor. Generally, a 2 pole is best for 1/10 2wd and a 4 pole is better for 1/10 4wd.
 
If running 3s on a 2wd, then I would recommend getting a motor from 3000kv-4000kv. As for 2 poles, or 4 poles, it depends on what you are looking for. 2 pole motors are much faster, while 4 pole motors have more torque (assuming constant kv rating). The Castle SW4 and 3800kv seems like a good combo for your application.
 
Thanks guys so much even though they say they can handle 3s you guys are probably right they probably can’t handle 3s. and i will get one of your guys options.


(that would have been funny if i plug them in and they started smoking LOL😂 )

Thanks again again!
 
I've had 1 plug in fail . it was a esc mk3.. it went up in flames on my work bench.. esc only battery was about 110Degrees F .. I had 2 gt esc fail on the track 1 last 1 lap 1 made it 2 then the magic trick was over .who let the smoke out who who.. that was Ko propo
 
If running 3s on a 2wd, then I would recommend getting a motor from 3000kv-4000kv. As for 2 poles, or 4 poles, it depends on what you are looking for. 2 pole motors are much faster, while 4 pole motors have more torque (assuming constant kv rating). The Castle SW4 and 3800kv seems like a good combo for your application.
How is a 2 pole motor faster than a 4 pole? I'm not familiar with this. I mean maybe if its not sensored but even then I dont understand what makes that statement true. Help my brain digest this :)

As for the SW4 and 3800kv combo that is not a good combo on 3S. Yes it will handle 3S but when I ran that set up in my Rustler I experienced some cogging and the motor gets hot fast. I mean maybe with super tall gearing you could pull it off but then you're kinda of defeating the purpose of having the extra voltage. For me, If i was going to try and run a SCT on 3S Id get the 2400kv Castle 1415 motor and then run a big pinion.

Thanks guys so much even though they say they can handle 3s you guys are probably right they probably can’t handle 3s. and i will get one of your guys options.


(that would have been funny if i plug them in and they started smoking LOL😂 )

Thanks again again!
You can technically run 3S on those motors RC Man, but it isnt practical. You'll have to run super tall gearing and the motor is going to get hot super fast, especially in a SCT. Now if you were running a 1/10 scale on road car then you could start utilizing some of those high KV ratings and possibly even run on 3S with those. In anything else its gonna be no bueno.
 
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How is a 2 pole motor faster than a 4 pole? I'm not familiar with this. I mean maybe if its not sensored but even then I dont understand what makes that statement true. Help my brain digest this :)

As for the SW4 and 3800kv combo that is not a good combo on 3S. Yes it will handle 3S but when I ran that set up in my Rustler I experienced some cogging and the motor gets hot fast. I mean maybe with super tall gearing you could pull it off but then you're kinda of defeating the purpose of having the extra voltage. For me, If i was going to try and run a SCT on 3S Id get the 2400kv Castle 1415 motor and then run a big pinion.


You can technically run 3S on those motors RC Man, but it isnt practical. You'll have to run super tall gearing and the motor is going to get hot super fast, especially in a SCT. Now if you were running a 1/10 scale on road car then you could start utilizing some of those high KV ratings and possibly even run on 3S with those. In anything else its gonna be no bueno.
2 pole motors complete a full rotation with only one polarity change, while 4 pole motors complete a full rotation with two polarity changes.

I've only ever run my 3800kv on 2s and stock (16/90) gearing on my Slash 2wd, and it has a lot of torque at the wheels. What gearing were you running on your Rustler? Also, I'm not sure how having taller gearing would help it run cooler.
 
2 pole motors complete a full rotation with only one polarity change, while 4 pole motors complete a full rotation with two polarity changes.

I've only ever run my 3800kv on 2s and stock (16/90) gearing on my Slash 2wd, and it has a lot of torque at the wheels. What gearing were you running on your Rustler? Also, I'm not sure how having taller gearing would help it run cooler.
Sorry, my mistake short gearing is what I meant...Bigger gear ratio. I really dont remember what gearing I was running on that Rustler. That was over 10 years ago. I just remember on 2S it did fine on 3S it was cogging some but I was running it onroad so I probably had it geared tall. I guess if you dropped the pinion size down that combo could work on 3S on road but I bet off road it was just over heat super fast even if you were running a small pinion. Just an educated guess on my part as I never actually ran that combo off road on 3S.

Going back to the motor part though, Thats interesting. I mean I knew that already but I just assumed that the ESC made the polarity changes happen faster so nothing was really lost. I'm gonna have to read up on that a bit and see exactly how that works cuz inquiring minds want to know lol :)
 
TNT is right, none of those motors are going to hold up under 3S lipo and the 2 higher KV motors are not really appropriate for a 1/10 scale SCT, even 2WD ones. The 4200kv would be ok on 2S with reasonable gearing. Id say get a Castle 3800 or 3200kv motor but I'm guessing from your choices you're budget wouldnt allow for that so Id probably look at getting something like THIS.

As for the wattage ratings, I wouldnt pay to much attention to that. Firstly wattage ratings between different manufacturers are going to vary widely. Secondly depends on how energy efficient the motor is. You can have two identical kv motors with identical Amp/Wattage draws (lets just say 1000W to make the math easier) and if one of them is 70% efficient then 300W out of that 1000W is getting turned in to heat instead of usable power. 300W is a ton of heat. Imagine your 50-60W soldering station and how hot that can get. Not a direct comparison I know but it amplifies the point. If the other motor is 85% efficient then only 150W of power is getting turned to heat and would therefore be a more powerful motor.

Gauss strength (how powerful the magnets are) also play a big part in how fast/powerful a motor is too. The stronger the magnets the better but unless you're racing Gauss strength really isnt that important and really neither is the efficiency if you're just bashing. Efficiency you can sometimes find listed with a motors specs but Gauss strength not so much. They make Gauss testers and efficiency testers etc that you can buy and compare motors, heck they even have RC dynos now a days, but again if you aint racing you're prolly not going to spend the money on the test equipment.

Just stick with known good brands and try to pick an appropriate KV rating, lipo cell count, and motor size for your application and you'll be fine.
The link to the motor you suggested should i get the 4000kv one or the 3400kv one the 4600kv one. it says in the instruction manual for the motor that the best motor for 1:10 scale 2wd sct is the 4000kv one. And i agree with that because 4600kv is too much and probably wont have enough torque and get too hot. The 3400kv one probably has too much torque and will probably just make my sct do wheelies and not have enough speed. So the happy medium for that i think is the 4000kv one but i would like a second opinion to that from someone who seems like they have had a lot more experience with this sort of stuff than i have.

Thanks in advance
 
I wouldn't put the EZRUN 3660 motor in a 2wd short course. It has too much torque and it weighs a lot. My opinion, you would do a lot better with a lighter weight 540 2 pole or 4 pole brushless motor.
 
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The link to the motor you suggested should i get the 4000kv one or the 3400kv one the 4600kv one. it says in the instruction manual for the motor that the best motor for 1:10 scale 2wd sct is the 4000kv one. And i agree with that because 4600kv is too much and probably wont have enough torque and get too hot. The 3400kv one probably has too much torque and will probably just make my sct do wheelies and not have enough speed. So the happy medium for that i think is the 4000kv one but i would like a second opinion to that from someone who seems like they have had a lot more experience with this sort of stuff than i have.

Thanks in advance
Honestly you can run either. The whole torque vs top speed thing can be greatly controlled with gearing. If you run the 3200kv then you would just run a bigger pinion gear. If you're runnign the 4000kv you just run a smaller one and then tune it for your preferences. If you put a 16T pinion gear on it and it wheelies too much then bump up the pinion by a couple of teeth and try that. Rinse and repeat until you have it where you want it. Same goes the other direction. Motor getting too hot or too hot to fast then bump the pinion gear down a couple of teeth...rinse and repeat.

I wouldn't put the EZRUN 3660 motor in a 2wd short course. It has too much torque and it weighs a lot. My opinion, you would do a lot better with a lighter weigh 540 2 pole or 4 pole brushless motor.
A 3660 is the same thing as a 540L sized can. The only difference between a 540L and a 540 is the 540L is 1cm longer. I dont think thats going to add enough weight to make a significant difference. Torque can be controlled with gearing.
 
The 3660 motor is longer in length than a 550 motor. A 3660 motor is 36mm in diameter and is 60mm in length. A 540 motor is 36mm in diameter and is 50mm in length.

The EZRUN 3660 weighs 262 grams which is lot of weight in comparison to a 540 brushless motor which weighs about 180 grams. If it's a rear motor short course truck, then this extra weight will hurt the balance.

The KV rating is more a parameter of the overall power of the motor. A higher KV motor is equivalent to a lower turn (hotter) motor which with all things being equal will be faster than a lower KV motor. Another consideration is that most 3800 and higher KV motors are only rated for 2S. Torque vs speed is mostly a product of gearing.

I've had a good experience with HobbyStar brushless motors. This would be a good combo for a 1/10 2wd short course truck - https://www.rcjuice.com/motor-esc/m...hless-4-pole-motor-includes-program-card.html

The 3100KV would be a good choice for 3S and the 3900KV for 2S.
 
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The 3660 motor is longer in length than a 550 motor. A 3660 motor is 36mm in diameter and is 60mm in length. A 540 motor is 36mm in diameter and is 50mm in length.
Yes I know, thats exactly what i said in my post. The 3660 is 1cm longer than than a standard 540. a 550 is 3mm shorter in can length than a 3660/540L but unless you're racing its not enough to make any real difference. Also all can sizes are only approximations anyway, they can vary by a few or sometimes several mm.
The EZRUN 3660 weighs 262 grams which is lot of weight in comparison to a 540 brushless motor which weighs about 180 grams. If it's a rear motor short course truck, then this extra weight will hurt the balance.
Lets say for the sake of arguement that the weight you have listed for the 3660 is correct to save myself from having to double check it. The castle 3800kv is a 540 motor and it weighs 237g. I get that there are lighter 540 motors out there that are around the 180g range but again the guy is bashing, not racing.
The KV rating is more a parameter of the overall power of the motor. A higher KV motor is equivalent to a lower turn (hotter) motor which with all things being equal will be faster than a lower KV motor. Another consideration is that most 3800 and higher KV motors are only rated for 2S. Torque vs speed is mostly a product of gearing.
Torque vs speed is a combination of KV and gearing and you have to tune the two. You said it yourself that higher kv/lower turn motors are faster than lower kv motors. Speed is inversely proportional to torque so if higher kv motors are faster then that means lower kv motors have more torque. Additionally IDK if Id say most 3800 and higher are 2S only. There are a lot of motors in the 3800-4000kv range that the specs say they are good for 3S. That being said Id never try to run 3S on something that high kv for offroad use. On road would work though.
 
A 550 motor is traditionally 55mm in length.

The Castle 540 4 pole is heavier than most 540 4 pole brushless motors. Even if you are just bashing, a lot of extra weight at the very rear of a 2wd short course truck isn't a good thing, it makes the front end light for less steering and affects the balance when jumping. All the newer race versions of the 1/10 2wd short course trucks are mid motor which brings all the weight of the motor in a more forward position. So if you have a rear motor short course truck one of the best things that you can do is go with a lighter weight motor to bring the weight more forward. You can also put the battery all the way forward in the battery tray.

A lower KV has less total power with fewer RPMs than a higher KV brushless motor. If you keep the gear ratio the same for both a 3100KV and a 3800KV motor (both on 2S) than the 3100KV will be geared for more torque since it spins slower. If you install a larger pinion gear on the 3100KV to gear for more top speed and maximum performance, it will have less speed and torque than the higher KV motor also geared for maximum performance. This is also the reason the a higher KV draws more current since it's a lower turn motor and has more overall power.

Things can get a little more confusing when you compare a 3100KV on 3S and a 3800KV on 2S. The extra voltage will give the 3100KV more total power in this example.
 
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A 550 motor is traditionally 55mm in length.
Ok, so you're arguing over 2mm? Traditionally anything 53mm in length or shorter was considered a 540 and anything 54mm and longer was considered a 550. Now Theyve added in 540S, 540L, and 540XL to try and compensate for the fact that motor can sizes vary from motor to motor. As I previously mentioned they all vary in size by anywhere from a couple to several mm. For example take the Tekin SC4X. Its a 550 Can motor but has a length of 66mm instead of the traditional 60mm. Would you call that a 550 then or would you call it a 540XL because its closer in length to a 540XL than it is a 550? Tekin doesn't call it a 540XL they call it a 550 so to me arguing over a couple mm size difference in the length of a can is silly.
The Castle 540 4 pole is heavier than most 540 4 pole brushless motors. Even if you are just bashing, a lot of extra weight at the very rear of a 2wd short course truck isn't a good thing, it makes the front end light for less steering and affects the balance when jumping. All the newer race versions of the 1/10 2wd short course trucks are mid motor which brings all the weight of the motor in a more forward position. So if you have a rear motor short course truck one of the best things that you can do is go with a lighter weight motor to bring the weight more forward. You can also put the battery all the way forward in the battery tray.
Once again you're talking about racing. I'm talking about bashing. If we were talking about racing then Id be all on board with you trying to find the perfect balance etc etc but my dude isnt racing and if you're not racing it doesn't matter. I've bashed my 2WD Rustler with a 540 3800kv 1410 in it, I've bashed it with a 550 SC4X in it, I've bashed it with a 540 2 pole Tacon 3500kv and I've bashed it with an Orion 13.5T in it. For bashing purposes there was little to no difference in them other than some of them were just torquier motors than others.
A lower KV has less total power with fewer RPMs than a higher KV brushless motor.
I dont believe that is true. If you look at this motor chart from TPPowerUSA you will see that the continuous wattage rating listed for each motor only changes when the size of the can changes, not the KV ratings. That being said I have not researched that particular statement and if you can show me evidence to the contrary I'm willing to consider it.
Capture2.JPG


If you keep the gear ratio the same for both a 3100KV and a 3800KV motor (both on 2S) than the 3100KV will be geared for more torque since it spins slower.
A 3100kv motor on 2S will have less RPMs than a 3800kv. Were on the same page there but, the 3100kv doesn't have more torque because it spins slower. "Torque is determined by the number of winds on the armature and the strength of the magnets. A low Kv motor has more winds of thinner wire—it will carry more volts at fewer amps, produce higher torque, and turn a bigger pinion"

If you install a larger pinion gear on the 3100KV to gear for more top speed and maximum performance, it will have less speed and torque than the higher KV motor also geared for maximum performance.
a 3800kv geared for maximum performance will have more top speed and less torque than a 3100kv geared for maximum performance. Torque and speed are inversely proportional so you can't have a certain kv that has better top speed and torque than a different kv motor. you're breaking the laws of physics there.
This is also the reason the a higher KV draws more current since it's a lower turn motor and has more overall power.
Higher KV motors draw more amperage because it takes more current to turn the rotor because there are less windings in the can compared to a lower KV motor. Lower KV motors have more wire in them and therefore makes them more efficient thereby lower required current to turn the rotor. Here again though gearing can play a part in changing the current draws but again I put it to you that kv and gearing are all just a matter of tuning. You use gearing and KV hand in hand to tune the exact performance you want out of your kit. As long as you are within an acceptable range of KV for a given kit in given conditions you can make up for any lack of speed or torque with gearing.
 

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You can not add or subtract gears # to makeup lack of speed or torque all that will do is generate heat.either way.now if you want to run 3 cell well the motor better be able to handle that many volts but b4 that a esc will need to be able to run on 3 cells..a lower wind motor will have more torque than a higher wind.
 

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