The internet gods get pissed off at each other.

Welcome to RCTalk

Come join other RC enthusiasts! You'll be able to discuss, share and private message with other members of our community.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate
links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

FastEddy

The Slowest Guy In Town
Supporter
RCTalk Vendor
Messages
14,677
Reaction score
14
Location
El Dorado Hills, CA
This cannot be a good thing to happen on a Thursday.....
Internet traffic disrupted as providers feud
Large portions of network unreachable by others



Updated: 6:33 p.m. ET Oct. 6, 2005
WASHINGTON - Thousands of Internet users struggled to send e-mail and keep their Web sites running Thursday after a dispute between two service providers left large portions of the Internet unable to talk to each other.

Computer technicians scrambled to shore up their networks after Level 3 Communications Inc. refused to accept traffic from rival Cogent Communications Group Inc., rendering large portions of the Internet unreachable by others.

"We weren't able to get to our e-mail systems, we weren't able to get to our externally hosted chat systems," said Bob Serr, chief technology officer at Chicago instant-messaging provider Parlano Inc. "Some customers say they've had trouble getting to our Web site."

Story continues below ?

The rift meant that thousands of customers -- including individuals who use Time Warner Inc.'s Road Runner cable-modem service -- were not able to view Web sites and send e-mail to servers located on the other company's network, violating the Internet's premise as a universal, borderless network of computers.

The dispute affects roughly 15 percent to 17 percent of the Internet, Cogent CEO Dave Schaeffer said.

"The usability and value people get out of the Internet is highly dependent on its ability to be ubiquitous and affordable, and I think what Level 3 is attempting to do is undermine both of those core principles," he said in an interview.

Like other large, wholesale Internet service providers, Cogent and Level 3 handed off traffic from one network to each other free of charge, until Level 3 said that it was handling too much Cogent traffic.

"We felt that there was an imbalance and we were disadvantaged in that relationship and we were ending up with what amounts to free capacity," Level 3 spokeswoman Jennifer Daumler said.

Cogent's Schaeffer said Level 3 was simply trying to get Cogent to raise its prices, which at $10 per megabit are far below the market average of $60 or so per megabit.

Larger customers of each company have been little affected by the dispute because they usually sign agreements with several different wholesale providers.

But customers who rely entirely on either provider for their Internet connections would not be able to reach any Web sites or servers on the others' network, those involved in the dispute said.

That would include law firms, community colleges and companies like Parlano, which face lost business and angry customers from the outage.

"It's kind of a game of chicken to see who's going to blink first, and to see whose customer base wants connectivity to the other customers' more," said Alan Mauldin, an analyst at TeleGeography Research in Washington.

Parlano's Serr said he would stick with Cogent as his provider for the time being because he saw Level 3's move as "strong-arm tactics."

Road Runner said its customers have not been able to visit Web sites and send e-mail to Cogent customers.

"We are working to find alternate pathways so our customers can be connected with these Web sites as soon as possible," Road Runner said in a statement.

Representatives for America Online Inc., EarthLink Inc. and Microsoft Corp.'s MSN service said their customers have not been affected by the dispute.

Cogent ran into a similar dispute with America Online several years ago but it was resolved amicably, AOL spokesman Nicholas Graham said.

Cogent said it was offering Level 3 customers affected by the dispute a year of free service if they wished to switch providers. Level 3 said it was working with its customers to ensure they could reach the entire Internet.

"Level 3 is working with their customers and Cogent needs to work with its customers," Level 3's Daumler said. "If Cogent wants to make its customers happy they've got to figure out a way to get that connectivity to the Internet."
 
that pisses me off,

i would have thought there would have had more controls in place so one company could not bring down the internet. i know this time it was smaller companys, but what if aol & msn had a similar pissing match? ...i not a fan of more government control ..but I'm seems they should have something to say to keep the internet going...

i mean come on, I'm building a house right now & it seems they have as much to say about what will & wont be in the house, not to mention where , how high..etc

"$10 per megabit are far below the market average of $60 or so per megabit."

am i to understand this that if my traffic is going through there lines, when i download the new teletubby dvd rip @ 500 mb my provider has to pay them $10 - $60 per megabit? ..i know that can not be right, i must be missing somthing
 
8 bits = 1 byte

so it take 8 mega bits to = 1 mega byte

most isp's rate there download speed at mbps mega bits per second.. not mBps mega bytes per second
 
Last edited:
something sounds really wrong ..so at the $10 per megaBIT, a 3 megaBYTE mp3 would cost someone $240?. they have to mean 10 - 60 cents per megabit or something ..
 
Pilot-yes, you're right. ISP's don't "own" the network, they are merely providing you with the access to it. Even those providers like Cogent, Time Warner and the like only own small pieces of the network, basically the access from your house to their POP (point-of-presence). They then hand the traffic off to the backbone, be it Level 3, Sprint, MCI, AT&T, etc. About 90% of all internet traffic hits Sprint, MCI or AT&T at any given time and these carriers are the ones providing the connectivity to the web globally. Each of these carriers has gateways assigned to the other in order to pass that traffic around. For example, MCI has set gateways for Sprint, AT&T, Level 3, etc. When traffic on MCI comes to a gateway, the gateway checks to see if that traffic is allowed to cross over. If it is, it allows it through. If not, it passes it on to the next gateway.

These backbone carriers charge other carriers and ISP's to handle their traffic, and it can range from $10.00 to $60.00, depending on the bandwidth the carrier or ISP wants. The higher the bandwidth (i.e. the wider the traffic lane) the faster big chunks of data can move, so the more it costs.

What's tragic about the Level 3 / Cogent scenario is that the only ones getting hurt are the end users. Sure, Cogent is getting an earful from their customers, but it's not their fault. If Level 3 wants to up their rates to Cogent, they have that right, but if there is an agreement in place dictating pricing, then Level 3 cannot simply stop passing their traffic. Bad idea on Level 3's side, because other ISP's using them for access may decide to take their business to someone else.
 
i agree that is way off..

i think it has to do with aloted bandwidth.. kinda like the size of the pipe.. they can download or transfer 1 mega bit per second for 10 bux per month.. i dont think its bit for bit i think its based on alowed throughput.

like your isp charges x amount for a 1mb connection.. its not 1 mega bit its 1 megabit per second and if you wanted 3 meba bit per second you would pay more

sorry got busy and couldnt post fast enough..

well stated monkey
 
Then if all this information is so damn expensive then why does a DSL line pay out at around 29 bucks a month civilian side? I really couldn't see paying that kind of money for that limited amount of information/date per second. Granted all the posts above are WAYYYYYYYYY ou tof my leauge, but it seems like something getts lost in the translation...
 
There are two things to consider in this issue; bandwidth and volume.

We, as users, are charged for the bandwidth we want. Typically, a home DSL line is close to T-1 speed, which is 1.54 mbps (bits, not bytes). Now, the DSL provider most likely does not guarantee this speed, meaning if the volume of traffic on THEIR network increases, you may notice slower speeds. If you are looking to guarantee that speed, no matter what, you can easily look to spend three or four times that amount per month. There are also two components of a circuit's speed; uplink and downlink speeds. The overall speed of your connection is an AVERAGE of the two. Traditionally, carriers set their networks to have a faster DOWNLINK speed than UPLINK because most folks are more interested in downloading content from the net than upload. Confused yet? :confused:

Now, when traffic is being routed from one carrier to another, they charge each other on the volume rather than the speed, and actually it's a bit cheaper and more accurate for them. Typically, carriers connect to each other with very, very fast pipes, ranging from DS3 to OC-192. A DS-3 pipe can transfer 44.7 mbps (think a 500 mb movie downloaded to your PC in 11 seconds). An OC-192 pipe is in the 10 Gbps range. So, a DS-3 is roughly 40 times faster than a DSL, so for that speed, multiply your cost by 40. Because the carriers are connecting to each other with that much bandwidth, it's more cost efficient for them to charge each other for volume rather than speed, because that amount can vary from month-to-month. Think of it as if a cab driver were to charge you for how many people rode in the cab, versus how fast he drove (even though we all know JoBoo charges us for how far he drives, including the time he got lost!) The carriers figure that, because they've all spent money to increase their bandwidth to each other and their customers, it'd probably be a wash to charge each other based on speed, but rather to charge on the volume of traffic each carries for the other.

You know, I've probably gone deeper than was necessary or practical with all of this, so I'll shut my trap :x

Just feel, for once, I can add a little value to the forums!
 
Back
Top