Denver Colorado Pit Bull ban!

[retarded pilot]

how many generations would it take for you to think a pitt was trustworthy

example a nice pit mother has puppys that go to great homes & they have puppys that go to great homes etc.. do you think they would ever be ok? or do you just hate them because of the hype

sidenote i want to outlaw the gangbanger porch sitting teens getting them & purposly making them meaner so there wussie i need 5 friends to help me beat up one person who MAY have looked at them ass feels tough

 

[4u2nv]

I agree with ya on the gangbangers getting them and making them mean, but why do ya think they choose pits to make mean? because there already mean and they dont have to do much to make them real fighters. Like I said when I 1st posted in here, Pits are very beuitiful dogs, and Brindles are some of the coolest looking dogs there are, but there always going to be aggressive. I dont think the generations of nice ones will even do anything. They have it in there blood. Look at them two *** dudes with there lions. They thought they were all friendly and poop, and had owned them forever, but it still almost killed that one. Granted if people have them for guard dogs, thats fine, kinda what they were made for, but to have a baby crawling on them, or have them out playing with the kids, is just asking for it.

 

[.30savage]

ban's

thankfully we dont have pit bull bans here in alberta yet,but it's coming.i agree on the fact they are beautiful animals,to most people,to others like the voice's of any community they are mean and uncontroable.so far we haven't had any "attacks" on people,the one thatr have happened we're a rottie,and a blue healer-cross,but so now we have a new by-law...the mean dog by-law which means anyone who feels threatened by your dog you will face a fine...
not a little fine either..$250.00,after 2 offences!and like i read here earlier a dog is as mean as you make it,if a dog is on a chain,they will get mean if it's in a fenced yard,it's protecting it's home.
also they bite why? you walk up on it and scared it?,it was eating at the time?,i personaly won't own one i have two kids ,we raise shar-pei's,we have two of them,my buddy has two pit bulls,they have never attacked anyone,or his family and they now are quite old,but because of the scare he can't go anywhere with those dogs now.that i beleive is unfair to the dogs,all dogs in general...that's just my 2 cents

 

[RushRC]

Ahh...been watching a little shark week have we?

Yep - I knew it would come in handy!

 

[vbgagnon]

No, I am not saying at all that it is alright for a dog to bite a child. I am just saying that I think the cops choice of action was a little severe. And, after something like that does happen, damn right the dog would be locked up....provided that the owners were not legally mentally retarded. In which case, they probably wouldn't own a dog(not a pit-bull, just ANY pet) Yes, yes I could understand yours, or anyone's frustration if one of their kids got bit by a dog. All I'm saying is that I think that the police's choice was a little harsh IMO.

I didn't get to finish reading all the posts here, but these are my thoughts on this...

I am in law enforcement, and if a child is being attacked, has been attacked or is about to be attacked by a fiddlesticking dog then I can see the proper force being leathal force. If the dog is wandering around untied and had already attacked somebody wether it be a child or an adult (it doesn't' matter it this case) then the dog is done for. Have you ever been in the situation where any animal human or dog, wild or not has been cornered? Its not fun and proper force will be used.

Next time your bored go corner any dog and get it mad, this could be sombody little ankle biter it will do the same thing, just not on such a great scale as a pitt. /finish rant!

 

[.30savage]

if any dog ever threatened to attack my kids i to would use what ever it took to protect my kids,pit bull or not,i think that goes for anything or person i would try and help out.but there's two different things your talking about,a dog running around free,not being looked after,attacking things is alot different than a family dog that accidently got out of his yard.but both would act the same if you corned them as would your self..so putting all dogs in the same catagory is unfair.

 

[4u2nv]

well all I know is if I walked up to a lab or something like that, and just hit it (I would never do that, but hypothetically) the lab would think it did something wrong, and most likely sheep away. And a pit, if ya did this, youd be getting stiches somewhere.

I dunno, this is one of the debates thats never going to end. All I know is, I would never get one (unless I got one for protection, to guard my stash buried in my backyard.. oops did I say that outloud?, and I sure as hell would never trust one. And I think its very ignorant to not think there naturally aggressive and are safe to have kids around.

 

[Plaidfish]

first off, you can't say if you knocked a random Pit bull he is definately going to attack you.....that is ignorant....second what was your addy again so I can find your unprotected stash

seriously dogs are very family or pack oriented.....the group is always more important than the individual.....have you ever seen a pack of dogs (strays even) one gets clobbered and rather than running away the others will attack the threat....if hte threat becomes too great they will run (saving the pack) leaving the one but they will always TRY to save the one....strength is very important to dogs...it's actually a law of nature.....you know the whole "only th estrong survive" natural selection law....yes animals accept that...when they are weak they accept death.....if you do not prove your capable of leading the pack then you will be challenged.....If they are going to ban one animal from being a pet they may as wel ban them all....I've seen Cocker spaniels tear ass on people and do serious damage......any dog can be violent and any dog can be tame.....I'll bet if someone could run a database query on dog attacks around the country they'd probably find that the percentage of them that are actually pit bull attacks would be very low compared to other breeds......St. Bernards scare the hell out of me...that's a pretty viscious dog when it wants to be but since everyone has been raised on cartoons showing them carrying that barrel of booze and helping people they aren't even looked at twice as being mean or aggressive.....they can crush bone with ease and yet if you saw one of them walking down the street you'd want to pet it and hug it.....I don't even consider the breed of dog when it comes to approaching it...I look at it's body language and actions...if a dog doesn't want you near it they let you know...if you choose to go up to one that's tense you should be held accountable for your actions don't blame the dog (this happens all the time and is yet another example of people placing blame anywhere but where it belongs).....ignorance runs rampant in our society but people hear that word and view it as an insult....
ig·no·rance n. The condition of being uneducated, unaware, or uninformed
the lack of knowledge or education
where in that dictionary dot com definition does the word imply stupid or insultin any way.....we are a very ignorant society in many ways knowledge of animals for most of the country is one form of ignorance as well....how can you honestly expect to interact w/ any animal when you are ignorant of it's individual character???
someone likened this ban to a lower form of racism...it is....black people were thought of as a different species than white people many years ago so back then it wasn't really racism to white people...it was hating an animal because of.....IGNORANCE.....sort of like a lot of peoples ignorance about dogs....
........yes some dogs are just mean and aggressive and they should be kept away from people or put down if they are a threat.....but to stand up and just ban an entire species for the actions of a small percentage or for the actions of their owners is wrong in my opinion.....

 

[cvec7]

well all I know is if I walked up to a lab or something like that, and just hit it (I would never do that, but hypothetically) the lab would think it did something wrong, and most likely sheep away. And a pit, if ya did this, youd be getting stiches somewhere.

I dunno, this is one of the debates thats never going to end. All I know is, I would never get one (unless I got one for protection, to guard my stash buried in my backyard.. oops did I say that outloud?, and I sure as hell would never trust one. And I think its very ignorant to not think there naturally aggressive and are safe to have kids around.

uhoh....better watch out, vb's in law-inforcement, all he has to do is get your ip, and bam! lol, :jk:

 

[kwong2001]

first off, you can't say if you knocked a random Pit bull he is definately going to attack you.....that is ignorant....second what was your addy again so I can find your unprotected stash

seriously dogs are very family or pack oriented.....the group is always more important than the individual.....have you ever seen a pack of dogs (strays even) one gets clobbered and rather than running away the others will attack the threat....if hte threat becomes too great they will run (saving the pack) leaving the one but they will always TRY to save the one....strength is very important to dogs...it's actually a law of nature.....you know the whole "only th estrong survive" natural selection law....yes animals accept that...when they are weak they accept death.....if you do not prove your capable of leading the pack then you will be challenged.....If they are going to ban one animal from being a pet they may as wel ban them all....I've seen Cocker spaniels tear ass on people and do serious damage......any dog can be violent and any dog can be tame.....I'll bet if someone could run a database query on dog attacks around the country they'd probably find that the percentage of them that are actually pit bull attacks would be very low compared to other breeds......St. Bernards scare the hell out of me...that's a pretty viscious dog when it wants to be but since everyone has been raised on cartoons showing them carrying that barrel of booze and helping people they aren't even looked at twice as being mean or aggressive.....they can crush bone with ease and yet if you saw one of them walking down the street you'd want to pet it and hug it.....I don't even consider the breed of dog when it comes to approaching it...I look at it's body language and actions...if a dog doesn't want you near it they let you know...if you choose to go up to one that's tense you should be held accountable for your actions don't blame the dog (this happens all the time and is yet another example of people placing blame anywhere but where it belongs).....ignorance runs rampant in our society but people hear that word and view it as an insult....
ig·no·rance n. The condition of being uneducated, unaware, or uninformed
the lack of knowledge or education
where in that dictionary dot com definition does the word imply stupid or insultin any way.....we are a very ignorant society in many ways knowledge of animals for most of the country is one form of ignorance as well....how can you honestly expect to interact w/ any animal when you are ignorant of it's individual character???
someone likened this ban to a lower form of racism...it is....black people were thought of as a different species than white people many years ago so back then it wasn't really racism to white people...it was hating an animal because of.....IGNORANCE.....sort of like a lot of peoples ignorance about dogs....
........yes some dogs are just mean and aggressive and they should be kept away from people or put down if they are a threat.....but to stand up and just ban an entire species for the actions of a small percentage or for the actions of their owners is wrong in my opinion.....

So how do you feel about our government targeting muslims at airports? Are you against any type of "racial profiling." What if statistically, a certain group has significantly higher percentage of criminals? Should we then treat a "certain group" just the same as another group?

Oh, and since you wanna mention statistics, i'd love to know how many people pit bulls have killed compared to other breeds of dogs. Any dog has the potential to attack, but there's only the special few that are actually capable of killing someone. When's the last time you heard of a chihuahua killing someone? And when's the last time you heard about a pit bull killing someone?

And while we're on the subject, since it's so horrible and violates animal rights, I sure hope you're a vegetarian, cows and chickens die everyday, and in larger numbers than pit bulls.

 

[Plaidfish]

dude mellow out, NO I am not against profiling in any way.....but I'm sure an animal is not going to "lie" and sit there and slobber all over til you get close and then tear your arm off.....as far as other breeds killing people...it happens all over the world by other species in the wild and ones living in what we would consider sub habitable conditions...so picking a chihuahua is going to the opposite extreme to make a point isn't it??....NO i'm not a vegetarian...I'm a firm beleiver in eating meat...have no qualms against farming animals or hunting them....do it humanely and not torture them is the only issues I have w/ animal cruelty....and as far as hundreds of animals being slaughtered daily they are used in the whole "circle of life" that I'm sure you've studied in biology class.....what I have an issue w/ is someone saying that ALL pit bulls are bad so lets kill em....hey we have plenty of people around saying ALL muslims are bad....they want to take over the world and make the white man their slaves and all that crap.....so should we start writing laws having Muslim hunting season.....NO.....lets not take one extreme and make it the opposite extreme.....ALL pit bulls are not bad....just like all your examples were chosen to show an extreme to some degree the Media shows us that pit bulls are the extreme when they are not...they are just like EVERY other dog when it comes to personality......I have spent a lot of time around dogs growing up....may different breeds and from what I've personally seen (not read or heard in the media) tells me they are no different than a beagle that's been mistreated and raised in bad conditions.....instead of pointing fingers at the breed, I agree w/ what was said earlier....look at the owners and put them down instead....look I got no beef w/ anyone here but some subjects I can personally feel strongly about...your post seemed like you are trying your very best to come down on me....and beleive me just like a dog gets cornered and fights back trust me people can too...some better than others should we put them down too?????
maybe you didn't notice the definition of ignorance I posted before...it's not an insulting word...more of a thought inspiring one.....

 

[kwong2001]

Yeah, but the thing you must understand, by saying we shouldn't generalize and say we CAN'T put down the pit bull breed, you're bringing in more questions than answers.

For example, correct me if i'm wrong, but you've basically said the owners are responsible for training their dog, and to some degree, dogs are still slave to instinct? So by that token, would that make if right for people to own tigers, lions, or maybe a pack of wolves? I mean, shouldn't they also be fighting the laws that dictate which animals are acceptable to have as pets, not just pit bulls, but every other animal.

And why do people value the lives of a select dog breed, but not all the millions of cows and chickens that are killed every year to feed us? Sure, you can argue circle of life, but that makes the argument worse, because it is not necessary in any way to domesticate dogs to begin with. So why do we value them so much? Sure the dog can fetch a stick after months of training, he still licks his balls and wipes his ass on the carpet.

And to bring back the whole muslims thing, I sure hope the "save the pit bulls" activists DON'T shoot dirty looks to muslims. And I SERIOUSLY hope they never shot a muslim a dirty look immediately after 9/11 or wondered if the person had a bomb or was a terrorist. Because it's wrong to generalize.

 

[Plaidfish]

your absolutely right about owning other animals.....My personal opinion is how can the government tell me what I can do/own/think/watch/build all those things....yes people can be put in harms way from idiots.....I still think that's just a fact of life no law or government can protect you from other people no matter how many they make....I do feel if someone wants to own a tiger they should be able to if they have the ability to do so......who decides that "ability" is where I have the issues.....lets look at this on a much lower level of lawmaking: home owners associations, now you buy a home you pay for it you live in it and yet there are people that tell you you can't change your oil in YOUR driveway because your neighbors think it looks unclean or for whatever reason......that's crap.....but it's just another way for a few people to have a hold on the masses ...they can limit your freedoms til you have none.....I moved from my Condo last year because they said the cage I built for my Tegu was not allowed on the balcony....there was no rule in the book when I made it but they changed it once I did it.....that's screwed up.....our government is supposed to be one based on personal freedoms....that was the whole foundation for starting this country right?......more and more every day our lawmakers are writing so many laws that eventually you can't sneeze w/o getting fined for it...what happened to personal accountability for your actions.....yes other people may be hurt or worse by stupid people but I'd rather live in a country where I CAN do the things I want and be at risk rather than live in a plastic sterilized "we will protect you" type of government....all that crap is a big F'ing pacifier for the masses...the reality is they CAN'T protect you ....unless they assign a body guard to every stinking person they just can't give me that security.....trust me I've seen serious crap pulled by our police dept that violates Civil and personal freedoms on soooo many levels it's scary......I'd rather live free than be made to live in my own home like it's a jail cell.....that's where we are headed if people don't stop and realize that every law they pass makes it easier for them to "ammend" it until they get what they want....today the law bans Pit bulls.....well a year from now they ammend it to include something not even close to a dog like you can't own a rock because they are known to cause serious harm.......you should really take a look at some of the bills that are on the table all over the country.....if you read them you'll flip they can write stuff that has multiple laws wrapped in one bill that have absolutely nothing to do w/ each other and people hear the commercial for "vote yes for your school budget increases".......but if they read the bill before they voted and understood it they'd see oh there's also a pay increase for the mayor/a rezoning commitee for your neighborhood/ a late night curfew/ and a ban on planting non-native grass in your yard all wrapped in one bill...but all you knew was it would increase your school's budget....and if you think that example is an exageration think again......I say scrap all the laws down to the basics...I honestly feel the ten commandments can pretty much cover the spectrum when left to an honest judge to make a decision......my point is just today the law says pit bull ban once it's passed they can change it at will and not have to let you know anything about it.....I vote no on every ammendment that comes around....for the simple fact that we have enough bulllshit laws onthe books.....at one time I honestly though I wanted to be a lawyer so I could try and do something good from within a system that is slowly crumbling......I'm not that strong.....I know I would go to an early grave fighting that fight.......I understand people are afraid of dogs...I understand that there are dangerous dogs but there are things WAY more deadly or harmful than dog attacks.....people get hurt everyday.....people die everyday....are they going to make it illegal to get hurt just so we don't gum up the gov. machine???? C'mon get real you can get hit by a carwhile waiting for a bus/walking down the street/or sitting in your house watching TV on your sofa.......more people are killed every day in those instances than all dog attacks combined.......I'm done w/ my rant...I just hope people take it in th eright context.....

 

[kwong2001]

So why don't we just do away with the government all together? Or better yet, if people want to own pit bulls SOOO bad, then just move out of state where it's still legal.

BTW, I do agree that the government is turning into bullshit...i've said many times, we've ceased being a democracy, i.e. washington state gubanatorial (sp?) election (still pissed about that, fiddlesticks gregoire). But I mean, what is SOOO bad about banning one breed of dog? You know dogs are related to wolves, and wolves are more or less banned? I don't see the complaints of discrimination against wolves.

Also, when you really think about it, there is no fundamental need to own a dog, and there's for damn sure NO NEED to own a pit bull. I have to wonder the real reason why anyone would own a pit bull in the first place, especially with the variety of less aggressive looking animals to begin with. Yep, I said it, I think most people own a pit bull because they want a mean, aggressive looking dog.

And if you bring up home security, sorry but Brinks Home Security and H&K can be all the home security you need, and the cost can be a lot less than a dog, especially factoring in cost of food and medical.

And the very fact anyone would use a dog to protect a home says something, it's not like my rabbit is exactly gonna fiddlesticks up an intruder...and when's the last time you heard about a rabbit who kills some boy?

 

[Plaidfish]

this can go back and forth for a while and neither of us will say Uncle......personally I think the fact the way laws are written is BS to begin w/ should be enough reason for people to just stop voting them in.....and as a matter of fact I stated in the last post I do think if you want to have a tiger...by all means you should be able to....BUT you are accepting the responsibility of your livestock.....yes that means that you or I could be hurt by this animal.....but my point was I would rather live in a country that has the freedom for you to make that decision for yourself rather than demand laws that would protect you from yourself....instead of looking to the gov to save us from ourselves whatever happened to person accountability????...are we all stupid and need to be told like little children don't go jump off that cliff w/ your snowboard...you might get hurt....so lets make it illegal.....don't own a pit bull....it might hurt you or someone else...so lets make it lillegal.....if I choose to do any of those things I should be held accountable for my actions....I should have been smart enough to learn about the thing I wanted to do before I did it...instead now if I decide to get a pit bull and it attacks me I can probably sue the guy I bought it from because he sold me a dangerous dog.....and I'd more than likely win....that's horse poop.....my favorite is the other scenario about the snowboarding.....that idiot who went to killington and went down an advance trail and decided he wanted to hit a jump and now he's paralyzed...hey sucks to be him but he made that choice......no one put a gun to his families head and told him to do it or they die.....well he sued Killington and won...now if you so much as hop and a ski patrol sees it you can get booted from the mountain....yeay....I'm saved from my self again......freedom is about choice, and using your brain to make the right ones...not about making laws to limit your ability to make a choice......lets stop allowing th elaws to dictate your's and my choices we are allowed to make.....yes if citizen "A" makes a bad choice and someone else gets hurt it sucks...but don't punish the other million citizen "A"s out there who didn't make the wrong choice.....can you see my point?......If you really think that having a law on the books limiting your freedom to choose is a good thing then I think you missed the whole point of this nation being founded......things die in nature all the time, get over it.....if it's my time, I hope I can face it with my boots on and a smile on my face...cause when it's time, it's time....no arguing, no crying, just time

 

[kwong2001]

Well to me, it just sounds like you're completely anti-government. Granted, our government has gone to poop...but i'd rather live here than in any other country.

But it seems all you really want is to live your own life and not have ANYONE tell you what you can and cannot do, that's great and all, but lets just say, I hope you carry a gun everywhere you go, because that's what life would be like. If someone wants to go on a killing spree just for the hell of it, they will. If someone wants to get completely hammered and drive in the opposite lane of traffic, they will. If someone wants to kidnap kids, rape them, or maybe give them extreme overdoses of meth, they can.

I'm not saying any government is great, but our government is a helluva lot better than 99% of other countries'. But seriously, get over it, with how industrialized our country has become, it'd goto poop REAL FAST if the government was suddenly taken away from the equation.

Also, here's something to think about, if you would support your neighbor owning a tiger because you don't want the government to impose themselves on citizens, assuming you have children, would you also support a level 3 sex offender moving in next door?

 

[retarded pilot]

well if you want to ban all pitbulls because there "inherantly dangerous" & theres no good reason to have a dog at all for the same reason why stop there....the freeway speed limit here is 70mph lets ban all cars that can go faster since its illegal & we can't do it anyway oh and take out the radios there only a distraction that can easly cause a accident and hurt someone

& motorcycles, very dangerous and unnesesary get rid of them ...you have a better chance of your battery charger shorting out & killing your family whele you sleep than my pitbull biting you so i guess there banned etc...

i know some of my examples are out there but so are some of the ones I'm reading
all I'm saying if were gonna ban something dangerous were does it stop?

 

[kwong2001]

Like I said, if the government has no right to govern the public, then we shouldn't have a government at all.

And like I also said, people are getting up in arms over this whole banning pit bulls...but they still have no reason to REALLY own specifically a pit bull, or even any dog for that matter. I say quit your bitching, and if you're gonna bitch, best be bitching about everything the government has EVER done. It can't be one sided.

 

[4u2nv]

I dont think they should ban them ALL, (Cuz like I said, some people need the prtection, Like when I had my shop, I thought about getting one, cuz it was cheaper than a alarm..lol.. Plus if I owned a Junk yard, Id get a mean ass one) but I really think the government should do pitbull permits and regualte how there out there and as to who owns them.

 

[greenwing7]

I'd bet the reason they looked past regulatoin and licensing pitbulls is because it was too much trouble, speaking of accountability, I love the 85 year old woman who is sueing rockstar because she got GTA SA for hre 14yo grandson, ummm excuse me but weren't these games intended for people above the age of 17 to begin with. oh and if you want security, the two body guards Mr. smith & Mr. Wesson do one hulluva job and pack one hulluva punch. and honestly I wish the snowboarder would have jumped off the jump and killed his lawyer and himself and simply removed himself from our society, why could they just not grandfather this pitbull law or atleast, maybe they did, give the owners adequate time ( I mean years) to deal with their pets. oh and I do believe in racial profiling 100% now granted I am a young aduly male, but as long as some one is not giving me poop 99.999% of the time I am not doing something wrong and if they are looking for a 21 year old white dude with a bonb by god search me and put your resources to better use. PLAD thanks for bringing up the bullshit that the gov's continually pushes through into laws because they ride on the backs of larger more publicly friendly laws, totally you rub my back I'll do yours. so the gov't needs to do a better job holding people accountable for their actions, look for terrorists where terrorists ARE, not everywhere just to make everyone happy, and cut out the bullshit its becomming rediculous