Question about fuel, stale or not!

[maxxFX]

I would consider my self experienced as far as nitro rc goes, been doing it about seven years! never had this problem and just wondering if its the case!
I got back from an event four weeks ago, and put everything on my rc table in my garage, I normally keep the fuel inside anyway, I had a 1/4 left in the bottle (byrons 30%)and left it in the garage, its been four weeks in the 90's, I went to run the truck and it wont idle like the nitro is gone!only runs if reved up, help with this please, I just bought a new gallon today but haven't run yet!

 

[aj200415]

I would consider my self experienced as far as nitro rc goes, been doing it about seven years! never had this problem and just wondering if its the case!
I got back from an event four weeks ago, and put everything on my rc table in my garage, I normally keep the fuel inside anyway, I had a 1/4 left in the bottle (byrons 30%)and left it in the garage, its been four weeks in the 90's, I went to run the truck and it wont idle like the nitro is gone!only runs if reved up, help with this please, I just bought a new gallon today but haven't run yet!

nitor evaporated away.

 

[beason]

always make sur you put the red cap and the twist cap back on after use or the nitro will evaporate

 

[kx250ryder]

The last two gallons of Byrons I bought do not have the red cap.

Edit: My garage is really hot too. Does that mean I have to start keeping this stuff inside?

 

[beason]

save old ones?? thats odd

 

[Revo Rancher]

Yeah, what red cap? I use Byron's Race 2500 and 3000 for my buggies, and never have seen a red cap!?!?

 

[beason]

its a seal that goes under the screw on cap.. my blue thunder has them

 

[Pinblaster]

I wouldn't think the nitro would go bad after only 4 weeks but it is always a good idea to store your fuel in a cool location off the floor. I can imagine if the temps got into the 90's outside, I'm sure it got hotter than that in the garage. If the jug was swollen from pressure when you opened it, then you probably lost most of the nitro content when you cracked the lid. I had a problem with bad fuel in the past but it caused the glow plugs element to break after a few minutes of running but never affected the idle. Try adjusting the LSN and idle screw first and keep an eye on your temps. If you start burning plugs then toss the fuel and used the fresh stuff. I've had to readjust my LSN and idle screw here in Ohio when the temps went from the 50's & 60's to the 70's & 80's or it would stall after running for a few minutes. After readjusting them I wouldn't have any more problems.

 

[aj200415]

I wouldn't think the nitro would go bad after only 4 weeks but it is always a good idea to store your fuel in a cool location off the floor. I can imagine if the temps got into the 90's outside, I'm sure it got hotter than that in the garage. If the jug was swollen from pressure when you opened it, then you probably lost most of the nitro content when you cracked the lid. I had a problem with bad fuel in the past but it caused the glow plugs element to break after a few minutes of running but never affected the idle. Try adjusting the LSN and idle screw first and keep an eye on your temps. If you start burning plugs then toss the fuel and used the fresh stuff. I've had to readjust my LSN and idle screw here in Ohio when the temps went from the 50's & 60's to the 70's & 80's or it would stall after running for a few minutes. After readjusting them I wouldn't have any more problems.

in hot whether such as in a garage it will very quickly.

 

[SkyMaxx]

That is interesting aj200415, I store fuel in my hot garage and don't have the same issues.

Nitro fuel likes to be stored in a cool, dry, and dark place. If you place it in a hot place, you could lose some nitro, BUT the most likely cause is either sunlight coming in prolonged contact (ie if the fuel is where the sun can reach it every time you open your garage). If the temps in the garage are consistantly greater than 100 degrees or close to that, you might see the fuel go stale more quickly, BUT the bottle would be swollen like you read about.

As someone mentioned, find a place off the ground and out of direct sunlight. If you can put the containers in an environmentally controlled location (ie indoors), then you might find they last a bit longer.

Note, not all nitro fuel makers use an inner seal cap on their bottles.

 

[Spokane HobbyTownUSA]

When you last run your truck, what was the temp outside? what is is it now? Hotter? May Need to re-tune for hotter temps.
I hadn't run my on-road car since temps were in the 60's and now we are in mid 80's and I had to re-tune.

I have left fuel in the garage for months during the summer for my plane and car and pulled them out and used them, I feel light is more of an enemy of nitro than heat.

Nitro Methane or CH3NO2 has a boiling point of 101 Celsius and a freezing point of -29 Celsius, so not very probable that it could evaporate unless your garage is getting above 101 c or 226 f degrees.


Keep in mind in Europe they don't use nitro(illegal) just alcohol and oil mixture, engines can be tuned to run it.
I used Byrons for years, after using the newer fuels I will never go back to it.

 

[maxxFX]

Byrons is the best but like I said I've been doing this for years I can tune any engine to any outside condition, there was no change in temp or humidity, from a month ago, the humidity in the garage is 100% and about 98 degress anyway got a new batch today and it works fine! fuel did go stale after 4 weeks in the garage and there is no seals under any cap I get from Byrons!

 

[HeartBreak]

Very odd indeed - I myself I have a half-gallon of Trinity's MHP (20%, the purple stuff), and whether ya believe it or not, it's about 4 years old. I store it indoors, on a block of wood, in a cool, dark, dry location (in a box in the back of the pantry), with the red plug under the cap. My engines (Ofna O1 Comp Bpo1, OS CV12, and Megatech M16) fire right up and run easily on it. However, I'm sure it's more like 5% now... :shrug:

I just give it a good shaking before running, to make sure it's mixed.

 

[aj200415]

That is interesting aj200415, I store fuel in my hot garage and don't have the same issues.

Nitro fuel likes to be stored in a cool, dry, and dark place. If you place it in a hot place, you could lose some nitro, BUT the most likely cause is either sunlight coming in prolonged contact (ie if the fuel is where the sun can reach it every time you open your garage). If the temps in the garage are consistantly greater than 100 degrees or close to that, you might see the fuel go stale more quickly, BUT the bottle would be swollen like you read about.

As someone mentioned, find a place off the ground and out of direct sunlight. If you can put the containers in an environmentally controlled location (ie indoors), then you might find they last a bit longer.

Note, not all nitro fuel makers use an inner seal cap on their bottles.

i set my nitro in my garage, on the floor, and its very hot/humide in there. my fuel ran like crap about a week later. i threw it out.

 

[retarded pilot]

Very odd indeed - I myself I have a half-gallon of Trinity's MHP (20%, the purple stuff), and whether ya believe it or not, it's about 4 years old. I store it indoors, on a block of wood, in a cool, dark, dry location (in a box in the back of the pantry), with the red plug under the cap. My engines (Ofna O1 Comp Bpo1, OS CV12, and Megatech M16) fire right up and run easily on it. However, I'm sure it's more like 5% now... :shrug:

I just give it a good shaking before running, to make sure it's mixed.

wow what most impressive to me is....you havent used a gallon up in 4 years!!
i can use a gallon in a weekend LOL

 

[FastEddy]

Hes letting it properly age like a good wine and only uses it on special occasions.

Brings up a good question....
How long will nitro keep if properly kept?
Does the oil or nitro start to brake down after a given amount of time?

 

[HeartBreak]

Hehe, more like a lack of a place to run a .21 - seems the neighbors don't like loud things. That, and the local tracks are controlled by a club that, well, it's all politics. I don't believe in sucking up to one or two people - I just plain show up to race (not to watch grown men throw tantrums).

Besides, fuel that old, I can call it Jesus Juice... as in "holy jesus, it still burns!!"

I was wondering the same question about age/fuel breakdown... Namely, kept under the best of circumstances, how long it lasts. The compound in question being the actual burning agents (alchohol/nitro). Does that stuff break down over time?

 

[Pinblaster]

When I started messing with R/C’s I inherited an RC10-T2, T3 and a GT from my g/f's late husband. I started out with the electric trucks (after piecing them back together) to learn before moving to the Nitro truck. I found 3 partial jugs of 5yo Blue Thunder 20% lying around (2 in the basement on a shelf, 1 in the garage). After de-gumming and inspecting the 2 OS.12CZ’s I found in boxes and the 12CV that was in the GT, I sealed one up and put it in the GT. Then I grabbed the fullest jug of fuel from the basement for testing to see if I could get it running before going to buy a new motor or fresh fuel.

The fuel burned and the motor ran but it was eating glow plugs like a kid with candy. After going through 5 of the 8 GP's I had found, I asked the guys at my local track for tuning help. I mentioned the motor was probably shot and the fuel was old and they told me “if the fuel was more than 6 months old, it was probably bad so get some fresh fuel first”. Got fresh fuel, new plugs, a new OS .12CV-R (just in case), and got a deal on a slightly used Losi XXX-NT Drake1 w/TX, that I now race. After realizing my GT starter box wouldn’t work with the Losi, I went to work on the GT. I started with the fresh fuel and an old plug (before toasting a new plug) and that sucker screamed, once I got it tuned. With the new fuel I managed to get 5 tanks on it before that old plug finally gave up. Since then I have only had to replace the plug once (after my g/f’s son soaked the air filter with water one day while running thru puddles) and the new engine is still sitting on the shelf in the box. I will be cracking the lid on my 3rd gallon of Trinity 20% this week and the GT still runs strong.

 

[rocknbil]

MaxxFX, 4 weeks is NOT going to kill your fuel. If it does, it wouldn't be for any ofthe reasons mentioned here. You probably just have tuning issues due to changing weather. How full was the container? Read on . . .

nitor evaporated away.

First off, you should probably look up the MSDS sheet on nitromethane. It has a viscosity (i.e., evaporative rate) that is approximately equivalent to water.

Alcohol, on the other hand, which makes up from 50-75% of our nitro fuel, has a very high viscosity rate. The point is - if anything is evaporating it's going to be the alcohol. But that's not what makes fuel go BAD. It's the hygroscopic properties of the alcohol. Alcohol condenses water from the AIR. The water contaminates the fuel, not the evaporation. The evaporation of alcohol only accellerates the process, and evaporation is nearly impossible inside a sealed container - not I'mpossible, but nearly.

i set my nitro in my garage, on the floor, and its very hot/humide in there. my fuel ran like crap about a week later. i threw it out.

I was schooled once on plastic containers by an ex-chemist: he made it very clear that the "non-porous" plastic containers our fuel come in are not actually non-porous but have a microscopic "webbing" of long plastic fibers. When you set fuel on a concrete floor, the dry and cold floor actually draws out the nitromethane from the container through the plastic. Hence the possibility of "evaporation" in a sealed container. Never leave your fuel on a concrete floor, period.

If you've any doubt that it's the alcohol that's hygroscopic - go to your bathroom right now and without picking it up, look closely at the bottle of isopropyl alcohol you'll find there. See the droplets on the inside of the container? No nitromethane in isopropyl alcohol.

The best thing to preserve your fuel is to squeeze all the air out of the container. This reduces the amount of surface area exposed to air (which is why I asked FX how much fuel was in the container.) If you have a half-gallon and in a hot garage, it's **possible** the fuel went bad from water contamination, but I really don't think so, not in four weeks. But if it did - that would be WHY.

 

[Mr T-Maxx]

Rock-n-Bil....You Rock!!

Good stuff as usual man!

Hope the SunBurn is better!!

Mr T