DTS-1 Modifications

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Well, I didn't make too much progress this weekend on this. One, I was busy testing my car. Two, I accidentally burned out one of the photo sensors in the trap :( I ordered a pack of those that are arriving today, fingers crossed nothing else got messed up, but I think it's all good.

I was having issues with the trap though tripping the relay, even with a very short wire. Not sure what was going on, the current/voltage measurements were identical to the stage lasers. Then after I burned out the sensor, I was testing later, and it was tripping it, so hopefully I get it fixed and working tonight.
 
Sadly it was more than just the sensor that was fried :( Something in the circuit board is toast as well. I noticed that the voltage was not correct coming out of the board for that sensor, though it was because it was disconnected, but that wasn't it. Expensive mistake. I did get another (unused) DTS-1 unit from eBay though - which is ok because I did need another starting tree for my MT course that I built last year as it was tailored to using the stock tree. Just didn't plan on purchasing it just yet. Well now I have an extra speed trap that is for spare parts, lol.

So, the bottom line is that the speed trap is simply NOT going to work to trip the relays. Honestly I cannot quite understand it - the current is identical, and I tried using the same wiring and lengths. No dice. I tried boosting the current, but it's such a weak signal that it wasn't working with the modules I have. Rather than continue to beat my head against the wall, I just decided to add another laser/receptor setup that will mount to the unit and the reflectors. This one I don't have to worry about whatever is going on in that Traxxas board and chips. It's super basic and reliable to use.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B09SHQ68ZD/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07H95679S/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_image_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

This will mean the finish reflectors will have the lasers and some batteries on the top (luckily there's a convenient pocket to put all of this in them!). I will design and 3d print a black housing for the receptor that will block sunlight out, and that will get mounted on the trap. I will use the battery in the trap to power those. I'll also run the inline voltage boosters to make sure there's enough current.
 
I wish I could help ya, but electronics and me just don't gell well. But I am eagerly awaiting your solution to a drag tree. I still can't believe one of the big name brands hasn't developed one. Maybe by the time you get this figured out they will lol. That would be my luck anyway.
 
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The new DTS-1 unit arrived. I quickly unboxed and bound the trap to the tree, and it all worked. I hooked up the relays to the tree's other lane, and went to test, and something wasn't right. My god...what had I done? Some cussing, almost crying ensued, lol. Sure enough, something was blown in the main board, you know, the one with all the dang lights connected! I didn't sleep much Saturday night :(

I woke up Sunday, and knew I had a tremendously backbreaking, delicate task ahead of me - unsoldering all of the light wires, and swapping out the board with the one from the new system. This compounded between helping my wife make kimchi and running to the store with her. Actually, the breaks were welcome. I managed to get the job done - but - in the process I damaged two of the connections to the yellow countdown lights in the left lane! At this point, exhausted, I was like "screw it - they can see the lights in the right lane". At least all of the stage lights and red/greens worked, lol. Then while at the store with my wife, it dawned on me that since the countdown lights are always simultaneous (provided that both lanes are being used), that I could just wire them together. Ok, not a perfect solution, but I was very hesitant to try and fix the problem on the board (looks like when desoldering the existing led lights I tore the foil connections). I mean, I probably could have bridged the tears, but at this point I was simply afraid of causing more problems. In hindsight, maybe the best thing would have been to leave all of the original leds in, and just solder my wires to the post ends sticking through the board. Probably not the most durable solution, but at least no risk of damaging anything. Sigh. It's really not a big deal though. In fact it's only a problem if only one car is running, and they could always just use the right lane.

I also took the time to redo the wiring for the "set" button, and designed a 3D printed box for that too.

With that mess out of the way, I had time to focus on the timer - and my HUGE lesson learned - just should have kept the timer as a separate system entirely, from the start. I received my laser sensors on Saturday, but the lasers won't arrive until Tuesday. Meanwhile, I wanted to at least see what I needed to do to make them work (and IF they'd work) so I rigged them up to the relays and used flashlights instead of lasers.

20220410_210528.jpg

(wiring no longer perfect on the tree board, lol, you can see the wire on the right going over to the left, under the antenna board, meh).

20220411_072203.jpg

(cheap little sensors, actually work amazingly well!)

VideoCapture_20220411-082706.jpg

(you can see the relay is triggered (red light on) and that the timer is in reset mode and blank on the right)

Finally, some joy! The sensors worked perfect. I even had a convenient space to mount them inside of little housings just in front of the tree lasers, and I'll be able to mount the laser itself on the reflector units.

20220411_072219.jpg

(good spot for the timer sensors to sit).

I notice a slight delay when the timer starts after the relay resets when I move my hand. Need to test this along with how quickly the stop trigger works when traversing 132 ft of wire, etc. The delay might just be the leds firing up and not the timer. Talking hundredths of seconds here, but in the "file it under buying the wrong thing, but actually needing it later anyway" happy accidents, I have these delay timer relays that would actually allow me to adjust that.

20220315_071700.jpg


Now I need to design the piece that holds the timer sensors that go in the trap, and probably just like the tree, have the lasers mounted on the side of the reflector - but need to have some kind of protective housing for those in case of cars hitting them. Should also be noted that each of these lasers will require a battery pack, which I'll mount in the pocket (or inside) of the reflectors.

Finally though, the light at the end of the tunnel is visible. I kinda wonder if I could have done this entire thing using relay timers and switches, without using the DTS-1. Not that there is anything wrong with the DTS-1, it's actually quite "powerful" and well done, but there's something more attractive to me to using switches and relays that I can replace and work on easily rather than a microchipped board that you cannot replace chips on.
 
Finally though, the light at the end of the tunnel is visible. I kinda wonder if I could have done this entire thing using relay timers and switches, without using the DTS-1. Not that there is anything wrong with the DTS-1, it's actually quite "powerful" and well done, but there's something more attractive to me to using switches and relays that I can replace and work on easily rather than a microchipped board that you cannot replace chips on.

So, me being me (obsessed with solving puzzles) - I had some "free" time and got to thinking of how I could rebuild the electronics as described. Overall it was actually pretty simple, other than how to figure out the "Chinese Jigsaw Puzzle" of the red/green light triggers and the winner lane triggers. It actually had me in a bit of a brain fog for a day or two, but I figured it out while taking a walk on my lunch break at work the other day. Overall it becomes a simpler, less complex setup than using the DTS-1, believe it or not, and would allow for full customization of the timers behavior, as well as easier to maintain and replace parts.

The gist of it is this (and I'm sort of writing this here so I remember too):

Set:
Resets power. Everything is back to a "turn on" state. Timers begin counting. (or alternately, I could also simultaneously trigger a "stop" signal to have them sit at 0.00 (not sure yet which I prefer, as the timers counting could be useful for stuff).

Pre-Stage:
Laser break triggers light.

Stage:
Laser break triggers timer reset, and closes circuit that start the lane timers. There are two relays, one for each lane in the start timer circuit - so that both must be triggered to get the timers going.

Countdown:
The first timer relays begin. The countdown is 5 seconds, then an "on" time of .4 seconds that lights the first yellow bulb for .4 seconds, and sends the signal to the next timer.

The second timer relays begin. Same as above, sending signal to next timer.

The third timer relays begin. Same as above, sending signal to next timer.

The green light relays begin. (this is where things are more complex). The countdown is .5 seconds, the "on" time is on for 10 seconds(could be longer if desired). The signal out is intercepted by a relay that is triggered by the stage relay(that starts the timer when it opens). In other words, if the car leaves before the green light signal, it is now blocked, and the red light is on. The signal coming out of the stage relay is also intercepted by the green signal, so that similarly if the green signal comes first, the red signal is blocked, and it cannot intercept the green signal. If it sounds confusing, well, it is!

Finish:
Breaking the beam at the end (now there's only a single beam, it's not a speed "trap" like the DTS-1) sends a signal to the timer to stop. It also sends a signal to a latching relay (needs to be since it's a pulse of the car breaking the beam) that turns on the winning lane light, and intercepts the signal of the losing lane (very similar to the green/red circuit).

The ironic thing is I pretty much have 60% of the electronics already in hand. Just need a few more relays, and four more timer relays (I already have four). I measured everything out, and this little setup would take up the same space as the existing DTS-1 tree circuit board, and be a hell of a lot easier to wire up with no soldering necessary. Here is a graphical mockup of what is used and roughly how it's laid out.

treenewcircuits.jpg


I think what I might do is after I wrap up the lasers/sensors over the next day or so, I'll just get the rest of the electronics and build the new board. I have a shitload of LEDs and parts, I could make sure it all works right, then swap out the DTS-1 board pretty easily. Main thing is I need a working tree very soon as my team is itching to start using it in the next two weeks, so I'm ok with using the DTS-1 stuff for now.
 
Your making my head spin!!! o_O It all makes sense, I'd be in big trouble if I had to figure something like this out. I'm glad some of you are good with this kind of stuff because I'm sure not. I am enjoying following along the process even if I only half understand it. :thumbs-up:
 
So, me being me (obsessed with solving puzzles) - I had some "free" time and got to thinking of how I could rebuild the electronics as described. Overall it was actually pretty simple, other than how to figure out the "Chinese Jigsaw Puzzle" of the red/green light triggers and the winner lane triggers. It actually had me in a bit of a brain fog for a day or two, but I figured it out while taking a walk on my lunch break at work the other day. Overall it becomes a simpler, less complex setup than using the DTS-1, believe it or not, and would allow for full customization of the timers behavior, as well as easier to maintain and replace parts.

The gist of it is this (and I'm sort of writing this here so I remember too):

Set:
Resets power. Everything is back to a "turn on" state. Timers begin counting. (or alternately, I could also simultaneously trigger a "stop" signal to have them sit at 0.00 (not sure yet which I prefer, as the timers counting could be useful for stuff).

Pre-Stage:
Laser break triggers light.

Stage:
Laser break triggers timer reset, and closes circuit that start the lane timers. There are two relays, one for each lane in the start timer circuit - so that both must be triggered to get the timers going.

Countdown:
The first timer relays begin. The countdown is 5 seconds, then an "on" time of .4 seconds that lights the first yellow bulb for .4 seconds, and sends the signal to the next timer.

The second timer relays begin. Same as above, sending signal to next timer.

The third timer relays begin. Same as above, sending signal to next timer.

The green light relays begin. (this is where things are more complex). The countdown is .5 seconds, the "on" time is on for 10 seconds(could be longer if desired). The signal out is intercepted by a relay that is triggered by the stage relay(that starts the timer when it opens). In other words, if the car leaves before the green light signal, it is now blocked, and the red light is on. The signal coming out of the stage relay is also intercepted by the green signal, so that similarly if the green signal comes first, the red signal is blocked, and it cannot intercept the green signal. If it sounds confusing, well, it is!

Finish:
Breaking the beam at the end (now there's only a single beam, it's not a speed "trap" like the DTS-1) sends a signal to the timer to stop. It also sends a signal to a latching relay (needs to be since it's a pulse of the car breaking the beam) that turns on the winning lane light, and intercepts the signal of the losing lane (very similar to the green/red circuit).

The ironic thing is I pretty much have 60% of the electronics already in hand. Just need a few more relays, and four more timer relays (I already have four). I measured everything out, and this little setup would take up the same space as the existing DTS-1 tree circuit board, and be a hell of a lot easier to wire up with no soldering necessary. Here is a graphical mockup of what is used and roughly how it's laid out.

View attachment 145320

I think what I might do is after I wrap up the lasers/sensors over the next day or so, I'll just get the rest of the electronics and build the new board. I have a shitload of LEDs and parts, I could make sure it all works right, then swap out the DTS-1 board pretty easily. Main thing is I need a working tree very soon as my team is itching to start using it in the next two weeks, so I'm ok with using the DTS-1 stuff for now.
Now if you could just figure out a way for a GNSS to talk to your timers and stop the clocks when the cars pass the finish line 😉 Then you'd have a badass little system, all contained in the main unit, and no need for the traps. There has to be a way. The GNSS modules talk to your phone. Just saying 🤪

What you have here looks awesome. I feel for ya on all the bumps you've ran into. But developing stuff has a way of throwing you curveballs doesn't it? Persistence is gonna pay off though. I can feel it. I just wish it didn't make my head spin looking at your schematic. So when you build the second one... I'll be waiting in line for dibs 😉
 
Alrighty...I basically have it complete! Only thing left is to test with the 132 ft cable which comes tonight. Everything else is put together and ready to go. I tested with some 30 ft cables, and it was fine.

The trap laser sensors for the timer stop sits behind the DTS-1 trap, keeping it protected from being hit. There's not much too this little thing.
20220414_190612.jpg


It's basically two sensors and a battery (which also powers the DTS-1 trap).
20220414_191118.jpg


The lasers are mounted in the reflectors and I permanently aligned them to the sensors. Meaning, that if the ground isn't flat, instead of adjusting the DTS-1 lasers, I'd shim or tilt the reflectors accordingly and go from there. Note that those battery packs are just for testing - I'm replacing them with flat receiver packs and will hot-glue them in that pocket, and cover with a sheet of lexan. Should be ultra durable like that in cases of cars whacking them.

The tree sensors and lasers for the timer start are similar. You can also see my "solder wires and cover with hot glue" instead of using connectors for any permanent wiring points. (Actually I noticed that in the DTS-1 they do a lot of that kind of thing too).
20220415_071254.jpg


The overall tree base is pretty tightly packed with "guts". If I wind up replacing the DTS-1 electronics down the road (which likely, I will) - it'll be even more tightly packed, but I did make all the measurements last night to verify that all of the components would fit in there ok.
20220415_071223.jpg


You can see there are alligator clips for attaching the 12v power supply that powers the timing system. Out of convenience to the battery proximity, I did power the sensors using the power that is running the DTS-1 components. If and when I do replace the DTS-1 components, I would leave most of it as is, but the current "timer start" sensor would be used for pre-stage, and I'd put a stage sensor in place of the DTS-1 lasers. The bank of relays for the timer would remain, and the DTS-1 antenna and motherboard would get replaced with the timer relays and other relays. All of the wiring would be re-usable and the right lengths.

I replaced my "set" button and cable, much more durable and clean now. That would also be re-usable for the new electronics if desired.

Well, this is all of the new parts. The 132 foot cable will have plugs on both ends and can be wrapped up for storage.
20220415_070919.jpg


Transporting this thing I will have to lay the tree down in my back seat, don't want the thing falling over and busting the 3d printed light sockets, lol. Hopefully it's all pretty durable. I did add quite a bit of reinforcement to where the tree mounts.

Two and a half months. Man, this was a bigger project than expected, but I'm super stoked that it's done!
 
Tested with 132 feet of cable - and it worked perfectly without the need for signal amplification :)

278580384_10222699216252513_2914526913536093788_n.jpg


The timer consistently takes .4 seconds to fire at the start, so there was no question I was going to have to use timed relays at the finish.

278261448_10222699273333940_6367411003763527313_n.jpg


This little device is pretty cool, and kinda looks like a bomb, so I hope the cops don't hassle me, lol. I think I'll make a clear plastic cover for it for protection (though it is behind the speed trap).

278598365_10222699235252988_2138945219786168842_n.jpg


I have flat receiver packs coming today that'll replace those batter packs, and they fit inside that pocket, which will be covered with a sheet of lexan that is screwed down. (I should put some switches on these too).
 
I have flat receiver packs coming today that'll replace those batter packs, and they fit inside that pocket, which will be covered with a sheet of lexan that is screwed down.

278362646_1429834620804216_1397809880585630418_n.jpg


Works well :)

This project is complete for now - this weekend I'll be using it with my team. All the cable covers, etc arrived this week. I'll get some pics of it all set up.
 
View attachment 145960

Works well :)

This project is complete for now - this weekend I'll be using it with my team. All the cable covers, etc arrived this week. I'll get some pics of it all set up.
Very nice. How much are you gonna sell em for? 😉
 
I spent much of Saturday working on getting the cable taped up and stowed inside of the covering. As it was, I need 25 more feet of cover, which is on order. I soon found out that the laser sensors on the finish line weren't working because of ambient light issues. I went back home and made a black box.

20220501_221906.jpg


This worked perfect. The start line had enough stuff over top of them that it wasn't an issue, but I might add some light blockers for a sunnier day.

I calibrated the timers - got them to within .02 accuracy. I did this using a stopwatch app, and repeatedly triggering both devices. The relays only delay in tenths, so I couldn't get it perfect, but I think that's good enough.

Set up on Sunday at my new spot.

20220501_110321.jpg


Only had an hour to play before the rain, so the team wasn't coming. It was chilly, but no wind. Track was quite dirty, and I forgot my leaf blower, but I got to make a few hits.
 
I tested this on a bright, sunny day this past weekend. The little light blockers for the laser sensors were quite necessary, and worked perfectly. They are basically just 1x1x2 inch tunnels that I place in front of the sensor openings.

Only issue I really had was that with the bright sunlight, reading the digital timers was near impossible. Could also barely see the yellow lights count down, but the green/red ones were visible. I made a cardboard shroud but the sun was coming from behind, so that was useless. A tent (which I have) would have worked wonders. Obviously these things work much better on a cloudy day or after the sun is down some.
 
Big test this Sunday - we are running a cash days event and using the tree. Weather is supposed to be overcast, but I'm taking a tent for the starting line.
 
I realized I hadn't updated this thread in quite a while.

We've been using this setup a few times this summer, and we had a few snags but overall it worked out great. The biggest problem we had was lining up lasers on the big end. This was pretty tricky even with the DTS-1 portion, bright sunlight was the big issue. For the timer lasers, I finally made a yellow colored plastic board with a stand that I could place in front of the sensor so that I could see where the heck the laser was. I also made the shrouds larger, as it was *really* hard lining the lasers up into 1 inch squares. Other than that though, it was accurate and the guys loved it.
 
I spent much of Saturday working on getting the cable taped up and stowed inside of the covering. As it was, I need 25 more feet of cover, which is on order. I soon found out that the laser sensors on the finish line weren't working because of ambient light issues. I went back home and made a black box.

View attachment 146166

This worked perfect. The start line had enough stuff over top of them that it wasn't an issue, but I might add some light blockers for a sunnier day.

I calibrated the timers - got them to within .02 accuracy. I did this using a stopwatch app, and repeatedly triggering both devices. The relays only delay in tenths, so I couldn't get it perfect, but I think that's good enough.

Set up on Sunday at my new spot.

View attachment 146167

Only had an hour to play before the rain, so the team wasn't coming. It was chilly, but no wind. Track was quite dirty, and I forgot my leaf blower, but I got to make a few hits.
hello i think you have done an amazing job. i do have a simple quwstion I'm hoping you can help with. i have a vision problem and just want to add some brighter lights to the staging and the green lights. i realize staging has 3 seperate parts. is there any way you could e_mail me ? [email protected] i wont take up much of your time
 
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